ComplaintsforFull Spectrum Access & Communications Ltd.

• Initial Complaint

  03/12/2021

  Complaint Type:

  Order Issues

  Status:

  Resolved

  More info

  Our strata contacted Full Spectrum in September 2019 to supply and install a security system and access control for our building. The contract is over $15000 in total, including installation of an intercom system, a fob access control system, installation of security cameras and a recording system. Over 2 years and 3 break-ins later we're still waiting for them to do the work. So far they've changed the building intercom and that's it. We've made payments and seen nothing for the money we've spent. They make excuse after excuse when we call to try to get the contracted work completed. At one point they asked for more money because of a price increase for parts during the 2 years we've been waiting. We would like to either have the work completed by years end or get a refund for the money we've paid for work that hasn't been completed.

  Business response

  06/12/2021

  I'm not sure why the Strata sent you a quote for 2019, but the quotes were approved in September of 2020. The quotes labelled 2019 were quotes with different doors and different locations for the access control system as well as the video surveillance systems,  so all quotes labelled 2019 are totally irrelevant.

  There were three (3) quotes approved. The Telephone Access system, Card Access system and the Video Surveillance system. The invoices for all three quotes were paid in October 2020 for the Access and Telephone Entry System and January of 2021 for the Video Surveillance system. The telephone entry was installed December 18 2020 and was tested and working to all programmed suites and the postal timer and strike were all in working order. The invoice for the finished Telephone entry system was sent to their Property Management company ******** ******** ********** in December and was not paid until March 21st of 2021. 

  In April and May of 2021 I requested the amount of FOBs needed for the system. The FOBs are the electronic keys to open the doors and are necessary to have a working access control system. The FOB order is paid in full by the Strata before they are ordered and handed out. This is done first because they need to be allocated to the correct suites, and trades and programmed into the system before it can be commissioned. When i asked Trinda, the original Property Manager for this number, I just got back answers of where they could buy their own FOBs, and whether or not they could order them through ****** etc. The original Property Manager was Trinda and she had left ******** in April If I remember correctly, and a new Property Manager had contacted me and asked about the installation and came back with a number of 94 Fobs in total. The second Property Manager I talked with was an Assistant named Terri Anne G****, when I mentioned that the FOBs were in packages of 25, she said she would need 100. I told her I would order the FOBs, but I would need access to the building to start the installation. The Property Manager Kerry G******** answered me back with where the installation was taking place, what areas was I going to be installing in. I did not answer her back, this was all in the quote and I thought it was a waste of time to explain the quote again in an email that would take me about 30 minutes to complete for something this Property Manager could look up in minutes. 

  I didn't hear anything from the Property Managers or even the Strata about the installation again until September 28th 2021 asking about the Fobs and when they were going to receive them. I had sent her the Invoice for 100 FOBs in October 2021 about a month after the request. I was to meet the Caretaker named *** ****** to pick up keys for the building. I had met Don and picked up the keys and was going to install and asked Don if I could store my Pipe in the Telephone room which wasn't a problem. I told Don I would be there the week of November 8th to 12th, not the whole week but a couple of Days and the following week I would be installing. I didn't make it that week and I apologised to Don but according to this complaint it seems he didn't really care. So the Monday I was set up for installing the pipe and we had the big rain storm and the problems at other buildings were emergencies. I had mentioned to Don I couldn't travel from Surrey to North Vancouver on a daily basis with only 30 litres of gas allowed by the Province. He told me to hand in the keys to the Property manager and I did on the following Tuesday. * **** *** * **** ************ ****** ********** *** **** ****** *** ***** ** ****** ** *** *** ***** ** *** *** **** ** ** **********   

  Here is the email I received and I replied that I would be at the Property Management company to pick up the keys and I would start the install today. When I arrived today, I could not access the parkade without going around the building. I have since asked for a transmitter before I can start the installation. 

   

  ***** ******** ****** *** * **** ** ******* * **** ** **** *** **** *** ** *** **** *** ********** **** *** ****** ************  ****** * ** ******* ** *** ********* *** ******** ******** *** ******** **** ******* **** *** ******** **** * **** **** *** *** ******** *** ******* ******* **** **** *** ***** ** **** ****** ******* *** ********* ***** **** **** ******** ****** ***** *** **** ********* ** **** ** **** *** ******* ******** **** ** ***** *** **** *** ***** *** ** ****** ********* ** **** ************* *** ******** ********* ** ****** ****** **** ********* ** ******* ** ******* *** ** ******** ******* ** **** ** ******** ******* ********** ** ** ***** **** *** **** *** ***** ** ** **** **************** ** ******** *** **** **** ** *** **** ** ******* *** ***** **** **** ** ****** ** ******* *** **** **** ******** **** **** ******* ** *** **** **** * **** *** ******* *** ********* ******* ** ***** ******* ** ***** ** **** ** **** *** ** *** ********* * ******** ****** **** **** *** **** *** *** ******* ******** **** ** ** ************ ******** *** **** ** ***** **** ****** ******** ** ** *** ***** ** ************ **** ** ******** ** * ************ ********* ** ******** *** ******** ** *** *** *** ** **** **** ******* ***** ****** ****** ******* * **** ****** *** ********* **** ****** **** ******* ** *** *** **** ** *** ******** **** **** ******* ** *** **** **** * **** **** ** ******** *** **** *** ********** **** ** *** **** ** *** ********** ****** ** *** ***** ** ******** ***** **** ****** *** ** ****** *** ******* *** ********* *** *** *** ***** **** ** *** *** ******* ******* ****** ******** ** ******** *** *** ** ***** ****** ********* *** ** **** **** *** **** ** *** **** ******** ******** **** ******* ****** *********** ********* *********************** *** ***** ********** ******** ******** ********** ****

   

  Customer response

  15/12/2021

  
  Better Business Bureau:
  
  I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ********, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me.  Although there is nothing in the response that commits Full Spectrum to complete the contracted work in a designated period of time, I do believe that Full Spectrum is now doing their best to complete the work in as short a time frame as possible. They have been onsite most every day sine the complaint was filed.

  I am prepared to fully withdraw the complaint on the condition that Full Spectrum completes the contracted work before the end of the year (2021). But I do reserve the right to make a new complaint if the installation is not completed in the agreed upon time line.  

  To their credit, significant work has been done onsite over the past week despite some unforeseen issues hindering the contractors access to some areas of the worksite. A lot of conduit, junction boxes and wiring has been installed so far and the contractor is keeping the work area clean and tidy. I am satisfied with the progress that has been made with the installation so far. Keep up the good work.
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ******* ********

  Business response

  29/12/2021

  The above statement is more fallacy than reality. The person writing this is making up lies to make the problem seem worse than it is. The "revised" quote was done in September 20, 2020 and the down payment for the product (50%) was sent at three different times. The final down payment was sent in January of 2021. The Enter phone panel was done right away as they had the names and numbers ready for programming and was finished off and the remainder of the installation 50% was paid 3 months after it was installed. The 3 months to pay for a finished product is not unusual, but it shows me where there priorities are in an installation. I have consistently asked the Property Management company for a number of FOBs the need to purchase before we can begin the installation. I never got an answer until September 2021of this year, and they wanted 100 FOBs, which seemed like a very low amount for a Strata that has 52 suites. I had sent them an invoice for 100 FOBs and never heard back from them until BBB was contacted and I got a very nasty letter. The FOBs are needed before installation of the FOB (card) access system as you would hand out keys before you change the locks. I HAVE STILL NOT BEEN PAID FOR THESE FOBS. The weird number of FOBs is none of my business, but the fact that they refuse to buy these FOBS and have YET to pay for these FOBs, is not a normal way of doing business. * ** ******* **** * ******** ******* **** ** *** ********** ** ****** ** ** ******* * ******** ****** So I have to wait a day or two for any response, which has made this installation drag on way longer than it should. The property management company is: ******** ******** **********. 

  I had started the installation on November 22, but couldn't start until the 24 due to no access to certain areas that the product was being installed. I have since run the pipe and wiring for the 4 of the 4 doors quoted on this quote as well as 4 of the 6 cameras installed. I have been doing this since your their original complaint by the Strata President and have finished off about 80% of the work. I am currently waiting on a decision of what side of the door to put the reader on, and it has been slow and painful through emails. I should be completed this installation by the 10th of January, weather permitting of course, but STILL DO NOT HAVE FOBS FOR THE ACCESS PART OF THE INSTALLATION. The FOBs were the main reason why I didn't start the installation and I have told them that several times to no avail. 

  There was never a Price Increase for ANYTHING!!  I have no idea what that complaint was about? I have never asked for more money at any point since the quote was ACCEPTED in OCTOBER of 2020. The Payment for the Enter Phone was Paid in April of 2021 and I sent an Invoice for the FOBs in October of 2021, which still hasn't been paid by the STRATA. 

  Customer response

  04/01/2022

  The latest response from Full Spectrum is typical,  more excuses and delays. However, since some work has now been done and they have said the installation will be completed by January 11, I would like to wait until that date to see if the installation will be completed before concluding this process. The number of key cards ordered is the strata's business and that number appears on the quote so it's been known by the company for a very long time and there should be no need to repeatedly question it. The location of the equipment installation is known from the original quotes, however it's not surprising that the contractor has forgotten any verbal discussions with previous councils given the amount of time that's passed. The fact that the contractor is again asking for clarification on the installation shows only the lack of detail in the original quotes. Payment has been authorized for the key cards. So far no part of the system is operational - again waiting until the 11th to see if the install is completed as promised.

  Business response

  04/01/2022

  Response from STRATA:

  The latest response from Full Spectrum is typical,  more excuses and delays. However, since some work has now been done and they have said the installation will be completed by January 11, I would like to wait until that date to see if the installation will be completed before concluding this process. The number of key cards ordered is the strata's business and that number appears on the quote so it's been known by the company for a very long time and there should be no need to repeatedly question it. The location of the equipment installation is known from the original quotes, however it's not surprising that the contractor has forgotten any verbal discussions with previous councils given the amount of time that's passed. The fact that the contractor is again asking for clarification on the installation shows only the lack of detail in the original quotes. Payment has been authorized for the key cards. So far no part of the system is operational - again waiting until the 11th to see if the install is completed as promised.

   

  The quote is all that is needed for location, if the location was changed by any strata members, the quote would have been updated and sent to you with the changed doors. Since no one changed the quote or wanted to change the locations, the current installation locations are located on the quotes stated "Door Locations". Door Locations: (1) Main Lobby Door (2) Parkade to Elevator (3) Residential Inside Overhead Gate Reader (4) Amenity Room is written on the quote. The Parkade to Elevator means the reader is located on the parkade side of the door to allow access into the elevator lobby area. You wanted the reader on the inside and I don't have a problem changing that for you. The Location Rear Amenity Double Glass Door to the Patio is not seen on this quote whatsoever, so it is not part of the installation. If you would like to add this door in the future, this can be done by a different company, but can be added at any time. 

  The FOB order we sent in October of last year and haven't been paid for this yet. There were 100 FOBs ordered and by your scathing response, it sounds like you are not going to pay this amount or have no intention of paying this amount. 

   

  The date i gave was a tentative date, a per my previous response, weather permitting of course and the weather has not been very permitting. Please stop using this date as a deadline rather than an estimated time of completion. This is an estimated time of completion, I will most likely have this completed by this date. 

  I will no longer be asking for clarification of the quote and will install the product according to the quote accepted by Strata. I will be installing the Parkade reader on the Parkade side of the door as it is stated in the original quote. This is stated in the quote as "parkade to elevator door" which tells me that you are entering from the parkade side into the elevator lobby side. I am sorry for trying to clarify this for you and I will disregard your change of the location and locate the reader on the quoted side of the door. 

   

  The FOBs are NOT included in the quote for this system, the price was given on the quote on a per card price. The FOB amount was never given to me until April of 2021, and with 100 cards it sounded like a false number, but after your Property Manager confirmed the amount I had invoiced you in October of last year. Without these FOBs, the system will not work for anyone, so I'm not sure how you plan on calling the  installation complete without these FOBs. 

  These responses to my questions look like you're not interested in getting the system installed, but more interested in finding fault or an excuse to opt out of our contract and not have to pay after everything is installed. I am stating the same point as my original point, you have not paid for FOBs and the number of FOBs for the size of STRATA are very wrong, but again, I have continued to install knowing you can't use this system until this invoice is paid, so I am worried about your full intentions. 

   

  I have lived up to my side of this mediation through BBB, but have yet to see you help me in any way during this installation, in fact, the Property Management company as well as the Strata have been slowing this installation down due to your slow response and inability to come to a decision as easy as what side of the door do you want the reader on. It was 3 days before I could even start this installation due to the fact that no one had keys to access parts of the property. This is why January 11th is a tentative date rather than a deadline, but as I stated before, I will probably be done by this date. 

  Customer response

  04/01/2022

  
  Complaint: ********
  
  I am rejecting this response because:

  Clearly the contractor didn't read the previous response I wrote which states that the payment for the key cards has now been authorized. ** ******* **** ******** ** **** ********* **** ******** * ******* **** ********** *** ***** Furthermore, it now appears the contractor wants to ****** the strata by installing the parking lot access reader on the wrong side of the door despite a string of emails clarifying the issue.

  I have spoken to a council member who was present when the original quote was being put together. Initially they'd discussed the addition of a card reader outdoors of the amenity room which is where that incorrect information came from. That card reader did not make it into the final quote and there is no expectation for that installation so on this issue FS is correct.

  However, the original quote is incorrect on the location of the lobby to parking lot reader but it was approved; an oversight of the council at the time. If Full Spectrum were interested in being reasonable they'd change the location as requested in a string of emails which I have copies of.

  Another vehicle break-in occurred at our complex last night and we have no recourse as no cameras are functioning at present. This only adds to the urgency that strata sees in having the installation completed as quickly as possible. To hear that the January 11th date may not be the completion date is rather disappointing. 

  Sincerely,
  

  
  ******* ********/

  Business response

  17/01/2022

  Complaint: ********
  
  I am rejecting this response because:
  Clearly the contractor didn't read the previous response I wrote which states that the payment for the key cards has now been authorized. ** ******* **** ******** ** **** ********* **** ******** * ******* **** ********** *** ***** Furthermore, it now appears the contractor wants to ****** the strata by installing the parking lot access reader on the wrong side of the door despite a string of emails clarifying the issue.
  I have spoken to a council member who was present when the original quote was being put together. Initially they'd discussed the addition of a card reader outdoors of the amenity room which is where that incorrect information came from. That card reader did not make it into the final quote and there is no expectation for that installation so on this issue FS is correct.
  However, the original quote is incorrect on the location of the lobby to parking lot reader but it was approved; an oversight of the council at the time. If Full Spectrum were interested in being reasonable they'd change the location as requested in a string of emails which I have copies of.
  Another vehicle break-in occurred at our complex last night and we have no recourse as no cameras are functioning at present. This only adds to the urgency that strata sees in having the installation completed as quickly as possible. To hear that the January 11th date may not be the completion date is rather disappointing. 
  Sincerely,
  
  
  ******* ********/

   

   

  Full Spectrum Access & Communications Ltd. Response:

   

  The Card Access system is up and installed to all quoted locations. The door strikes have been cut into the doors and the readers are mounted and wired into the panels in the Telephone room. I've been waiting on the 100 Fobs purchased from the Strata since it was invoiced in October, so authorised or not, I was still waiting on this payment. I placed the card reader ******* has asked me to put on the wrong side of the door. If he wants it on the wrong side, I can put it on the wrong side, so it has officially been installed it on the wrong side. This goes against my 25 years of experience in this industry, but I will do what the customer wants due to the *********** nature of this person involved. 

  The cameras have been operational since the original installation date, which was before their incident happened. There is one more camera to be installed, and it will go in tomorrow. So this will complete the installation of their equipment for video surveillance and we are just waiting on the 100 Fobs for the 52 suites to share and the access control will be finished as well. I will be requesting full payment for the video surveillance system tomorrow with an invoice sent to ******** ******** ********** company as this contract has been fulfilled. The Access control will be billed with a 10% hold back with the final invoice until we receive the fobs for programming into the system. 

  I hope this makes everyone happy and even through the worst weather in Vancouver history has slowed this installation, it was still finished. I will be waiting on these invoices to be paid before we can move ahead with the finality of this installation and turnover of both systems. 

  Customer response

  29/04/2022

  
  Complaint: ********
  
  Hello ******,

  
  

  Please reopen the previous complaint #******** as per your message. 

  
  

  To date Full Spectrum has not provided the programed fobs and laptop + software for which we were invoiced.

  
  

  Jason at Full Spectrum refuses to answer our calls or respond to our emails.

  
  

  I've attached a copy of the  relevant invoices which are paid. Please call or email if you require anything else.

  
  

  Thanks for your attention in this matter.

  
  

  Regards

  *** ******** *************

  Business response

  10/05/2022

  This Strata nor any of it's members have never directly contacted me through emails, and I had received one phone call from one of the Strata Council member that was not very nice so I was not inclined to call him back with a response. That phone call was on Tuesday May 3. I have however, contacted the Property Management company and have answered her emails and gave her a date of hand off. This Stata took almost 5 months to pay this bill a week after it was paid, they open up this complaint again. The main complainant seems to make his points upon fallacy and misinformation.  In fact, this whole process has been a waste of my time defending myself and my company against this constant unhappy person with nothing but time on his hands. 

  I had told the Property Manager that I would hold back 10% of the bill until they received their laptop and proximity tags from us. I gave them a date of the second week in June as to when this would be completed and handed over in exchange for the last 10% of the invoice. That was my last email to the Property Management company to finish this Job. The fact that they've waited over 4 months to pay becomes part of that waiting period for them when the job was completed in the first week of January

  Customer response

  11/05/2022

  
  Complaint: ********
  
  I am rejecting this response because:
  The invoice for the fibs was paid in January. Why does delivery take 6 months? The laptop was included in the original contract and should have been delivered with the rest of the equipment. The idea that the strata hasn't reached out to Full Spectrum is completely ludicrous. As stated by yourself, you refuse to return our calls and have requested in the past that all communication go through BBB. You've gotten your wish. You've made zero effort to obtain and deliver the fobs. The delay in payment was your fault because you were supposed to have delivered the fobs and laptop at the time of installation. When a council member approached you onsite one day you said, "Oh not you too!"ran then away and locked yourself in your truck with the windows rolled up. The cheques were cashed in March. April has come and gone and you're saying that you will deliver halfway through June. This is completely unacceptable! The fob invoice was paid in January and there's no reason for a 6 month turn around time. You've also taken our keys and garage fob. If you completed the installation you have no need for the keys. We need them. Please return them immediately. You've had them for 6 months. Do you still need them because you haven't finished the job yet? If you're done then return them. Simple.
  Sincerely,
  
  ******* ********

  Business response

  24/05/2022

  The Complainant has completely made up this last email. I have never "*** ** ** ***** *** ****** ** ******* ** *** **** **** ******". I am not that type of person, if someone has said anything to me I am pleasant and will answer the question no matter how rude or obnoxious with a nice positive reply. It's the way I was raised as a human being. To suggest anything different is a fallacy.

   

  The 10% hold back on the payment for the completion of the access control system will be paid out when I deliver the laptop and FOBs and no sooner. 

   

  The Strata/Property Management did not pay until April after the threat of court if it wasn't paid, they'd sent the two payments about 2 weeks apart, the CCTV first then the Access Invoice. 

  The complainant has mentioned that I would not talk with anyone unless it is through the BBB, but that is also a fallacy and something that I have never said. What I did say was that no one has tried to contact me in regards to anything to do with this installation. Which makes it hard to confirm the direction of the cameras when you install them, so I used my own judgement. 
  

   

  There were many reasons in the last 4 months why they were not paying me for the work finished in January, they eventually paid the invoices in April two weeks apart. 

   

  The complainant will need the computer along with the FOB's to properly install them into the system to have it work properly. This is something that will be done after the exchange of the 10% final payment with the laptop and fobs. You can't use the FOB's without the computer and vise versa. 

   

  The change over will need to be at the end of June rather than the second week in June. I will let the Property Management company know this new turnover time as well as the complainant. When I click on the original complaint and I read over it, it is another fallacy stretching truth and comments that were never made. It appears that the complainant will say anything to make himself look like a victim. There was no request for price increase, there was no 2 years of waiting, there was no install starting in 2019, there was not even an excuse as to why it wasn't started. I'm looking forward to this next complaint and what wonderful nonsense will be written down to further his pursuit to discredit my company. 

   

   

  Customer response

  25/05/2022

  
  Complaint: ********
  
  I am rejecting this response because:
  
  I will address your correspondence parenthetically:

  "The Complainant has completely made up this last email. I have never "*** ** ** ***** *** ****** ** ******* ** *** **** **** ******". I am not that type of person, if someone has said anything to me I am pleasant and will answer the question no matter how rude or obnoxious with a nice positive reply. It's the way I was raised as a human being. To suggest anything different is a fallacy."
  
  This may be true as I've been advised you actually sped off in your truck after running away from council member *** *. But this has nothing to do with delivering our fobs and laptop. Let's please stick to the point which is your failure to deliver paid for goods according to our contract. 
  
  "The 10% hold back on the payment for the completion of the access control system will be paid out when I deliver the laptop and FOBs and no sooner." 
  
  If you ever deliver the goods we can address the 10% holdback.
   
  "The Strata/Property Management did not pay until April after the threat of court if it wasn't paid, they'd sent the two payments about 2 weeks apart, the CCTV first then the Access Invoice." 
  
  Thank you for acknowledging that you received full payment in April. The main reason the strata didn't pay between January and April is because the goods were not being delivered and we had no good reason to believe that you would deliver -our suspicions are becoming justified. The laptop for fob programming was part of the original contract (billed separate from the proximity tags or "fobs"). But it is still not delivered and the same for the fobs which were paid for in January and are still not delivered 6 months later. So despite your insistence that you installed a working system you still have not met the terms of that contract.
  
  Furthermore, on March 16 you sent an email to our property manager stating that would not deliver anything further until the invoices were paid.
   
  "I will NOT give you any more equipment until this invoice with a hold back is PAID IN FULL, we will send you the laptop with the proximity cards. After the laptop and proximity cards are dropped off at your office, we will be billing for the remaining 10% of the hold back. I will pick up the cheques no later than March 25th 2022."
  
  The cheques were made ready for you to pick up on March 25th. You sent and email on March 30th confirming you'd received payment for the CCTV system but not the access control. In that email you stated that when you received the payment you could "move forward" with the laptop and proximity fobs. You also stated that you would program the doors but would not program the proximity cards. This would be a direct violation of the contract. In that email you gave no time line to complete the work other than "once you received payment". A reasonable person would assume that to mean once you received payment you'd perform the work. Again, that email was dated March 30. 
  
  So after receiving your assurance that you'd deliver the laptop and fobs once you'd received full payment we paid.  We trusted you and paid you but you broke your promise. On April 21st I asked my property manager to remind you to deliver the laptop and fobs and return our keys. You did not respond. She sent a follow up on May 2nd. You replied on May 5th saying you'd deliver in the 2nd week of June (5-6 weeks later) and as of now, without reason, you have pushed that to the end of June. 
  
  You still haven't returned our keys though we've asked repeatedly that you do so. In case it hasn't been clear to you we want our keys and garage remote back NOW! Please return them to our property manager before June 1st. 
  
  "The complainant has mentioned that I would not talk with anyone unless it is through the BBB, but that is also a fallacy and something that I have never said. What I did say was that no one has tried to contact me in regards to anything to do with this installation. Which makes it hard to confirm the direction of the cameras when you install them, so I used my own judgement."
   
  This has nothing to do with you delivering our fobs & laptop and returning our keys and remote. 
  
  "There were many reasons in the last 4 months why they were not paying me for the work finished in January, they eventually paid the invoices in April two weeks apart." 
  
  The cheques were prepared for March 26th. You keep saying you had installed a functioning camera system in January and this may technically be true as far as the hardware goes. But you knowingly prevented us from testing or using the camera system by denying us a password to access the system until you received full payment. This dodgy business practice effectively rendered the system useless between January and April and is one of the main reasons the payment was held back. To date we have received no operation manual or instruction on using the system. Having said that, this has nothing to do with delivering our laptop & fobs and returning our keys and remote.
  
  "The complainant will need the computer along with the FOB's to properly install them into the system to have it work properly. This is something that will be done after the exchange of the 10% final payment with the laptop and fobs. You can't use the FOB's without the computer and vise versa." 
  
  We know we need these things to use them. Please deliver them.
  
  "The change over will need to be at the end of June rather than the second week in June. I will let the Property Management company know this new turnover time as well as the complainant. When I click on the original complaint and I read over it, it is another fallacy stretching truth and comments that were never made. It appears that the complainant will say anything to make himself look like a victim." 
  
  The complainant IS the victim of unreasonable delays, broken promises and unmet deadlines. Here you have introduced yet another delay. First upon payment, then mid June now the end of June and in the future maybe by Christmas! 
  
  "There was no request for price increase, there was no 2 years of waiting, there was no install starting in 2019, there was not even an excuse as to why it wasn't started. I'm looking forward to this next complaint and what wonderful nonsense will be written down to further his pursuit to discredit my company."
  
  There are documents attached to this complaint that are dated September 2019 which is when strata became involved with your company and begin to document all of this. I agree that no install was started in 2019 (other than the installation of the entry phone). No other work was begun until November 2021 when the BBB was contacted. Future readers can review the attached documents to see when the contract was commenced and see that it is still "in progress" years later.
  
  This complaint is not about discrediting your company; we'll leave that in your capable hands. You and your company either want to resolve these issues or you don't. Dragging this out week after week and month after month means more correspondence added to this complaint for future potential customers of yours to review. 
  
  This complaint is about resolving the outstanding terms of our contract. Namely: Deliver our proximity tags and programming laptop, return our keys and remote. We are not pursuing the camera positioning issues or even the drywall damage. We'd just like to receive the equipment we paid for in a reasonable period of time and not be subjected to ongoing unexplained delays and passed deadlines.
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ******* ********

  Business response

  11/06/2022

  I am rejecting this response because:

   

  (((( I will also address your responses to my responses parenthetically..  only with parentheses. )))) 

   

  I will address your correspondence parenthetically:
  

  "The Complainant has completely made up this last email. I have never "*** ** ** ***** *** ****** ** ******* ** *** **** **** ******". I am not that type of person, if someone has said anything to me I am pleasant and will answer the question no matter how rude or obnoxious with a nice positive reply. It's the way I was raised as a human being. To suggest anything different is a fallacy."
  
  This may be true as I've been advised you actually sped off in your truck after running away from council member *** *. But this has nothing to do with delivering our fobs and laptop. Let's please stick to the point which is your failure to deliver paid for goods according to our contract. 

  (((( I never talked with *** *. as he just made ******** comments every now and again, never anything constructive or regarding the installation. I'm sure *** *. had a heroic story to tell regarding his power of intimidation and my huge debilitating cowardness. If *** *. is as credible as you are, I'm not really worried what he said the interaction was.  ))))

  
  
  "The 10% hold back on the payment for the completion of the access control system will be paid out when I deliver the laptop and FOBs and no sooner." 
  
  If you ever deliver the goods we can address the 10% holdback.

  (((( The Job was finished in January and you paid me in April. I am not waiting another 4 and half months to get paid by your Strata. Your actions have dictated this situation as I don't trust you as a person to follow through with your promises as you have continuously lied with your complaints. I will not be waiting 4 months to take you to court this time though.  ))))

  
   
  "The Strata/Property Management did not pay until April after the threat of court if it wasn't paid, they'd sent the two payments about 2 weeks apart, the CCTV first then the Access Invoice." 
  
  Thank you for acknowledging that you received full payment in April. The main reason the strata didn't pay between January and April is because the goods were not being delivered and we had no good reason to believe that you would deliver -our suspicions are becoming justified. The laptop for fob programming was part of the original contract (billed separate from the proximity tags or "fobs"). But it is still not delivered and the same for the fobs which were paid for in January and are still not delivered 6 months later. So despite your insistence that you installed a working system you still have not met the 11terms of that contract.

  (((( There is no excuse to take 4 months to pay your bill. The Access control invoice is still not fully paid, and when the fobs and computer are dropped off I will be asking for the remainder of this payment to be paid as soon as possible, but from the latest actions, it doesn't seem like this is likely. It sounds like you have no intention of paying with your last response, so it will be a short time before this goes to court for that 10% hold back.  ))))

  
  
  Furthermore, on March 16 you sent an email to our property manager stating that would not deliver anything further until the invoices were paid.
   
  "I will NOT give you any more equipment until this invoice with a hold back is PAID IN FULL, we will send you the laptop with the proximity cards. After the laptop and proximity cards are dropped off at your office, we will be billing for the remaining 10% of the hold back. I will pick up the cheques no later than March 25th 2022."

   

  (((( You missed the email where I threatened to sue the Strata for payment and got no response,  in addition to the PAID IN FULL email that was not responded to as well. I got no response from the Property Manager nor anyone from the Strata in regards to this refusal to pay. So there was no response for over a month to the original email asking about payment that was supposed to be paid in January! ))))

  
  
  The cheques were made ready for you to pick up on March 25th. You sent and email on March 30th confirming you'd received payment for the CCTV system but not the access control. In that email you stated that when you received the payment you could "move forward" with the laptop and proximity fobs. You also stated that you would program the doors but would not program the proximity cards. This would be a direct violation of the contract. In that email you gave no time line to complete the work other than "once you received payment". A reasonable person would assume that to mean once you received payment you'd perform the work. Again, that email was dated March 30. 

   

  (((( The cheques were definitely NOT ready for pickup on March 25th. Why would I send an email on the 30th if both cheques were ready on the 25th? So your explaining in your response that these cheques were ready for pickup on the 25th. The second cheque was received in mid April, so I don't know how you can say that in your response. When you complain about something our company has done, please be truthful in your response. This is obviously a blatant lie as to when the cheques were even paid. I have been up front and honest with everything written in response to your accusations and complaints. You have not been honest with the simplest of actions you've done as a Strata President., including when I was to be paid by the Strata. )))) 

  
  
  So after receiving your assurance that you'd deliver the laptop and fobs once you'd received full payment we paid.  We trusted you and paid you but you broke your promise. On April 21st I asked my property manager to remind you to deliver the laptop and fobs and return our keys. You did not respond. She sent a follow up on May 2nd. You replied on May 5th saying you'd deliver in the 2nd week of June (5-6 weeks later) and as of now, without reason, you have pushed that to the end of June. 

   

  (((( I will have both ready by the end of next week to drop off to your Property Manager, the system will be programmed, but not the proximity cards. The 10% hold back will need to be paid at the same time I drop off the proximity fobs and laptop.))))  

  You still haven't returned our keys though we've asked repeatedly that you do so. In case it hasn't been clear to you we want our keys and garage remote back NOW! Please return them to our property manager before June 1st. 
  

   

  (((( I will drop your keys off this Monday. ))))

  
  
  "The complainant has mentioned that I would not talk with anyone unless it is through the BBB, but that is also a fallacy and something that I have never said. What I did say was that no one has tried to contact me in regards to anything to do with this installation. Which makes it hard to confirm the direction of the cameras when you install them, so I used my own judgement."
   
  This has nothing to do with you delivering our fobs & laptop and returning our keys and remote. 

   

  ((((When there is a difference of opinion and questions to be answered about the installation, the fact that you refuse to communicate with the installer then have the audacity to complain the camera is not pointing in the direction you thought is utter ridiculousness. Communication is everything when it comes to installations on your own property. The fact that I was avoided for the 2 months during the installation and then you complain that the camera is not looking at what you wanted it to look at. All cameras were installed at the far end of each room to view as many access points as possible. When you suggested the Lobby area camera look at the front door, rather than the mailbox, amenity room entrance, stairwell entrance and lobby telephone entry system. I would like to think my 25 years of experience trumps your opinion. If you had communicated with me, we could have had a conversation about it and we could have come to an agreement as to what you wanted. Instead you tell me you want it somewhere else looking at something that is already covered by another camera. I also stated that I could move the cameras for you, but would charge you an hourly rate due to your inability to communicate your wants before or even during the installation. Doing this after the camera installation just shows the pettiness of your complaints, and they are definitely very, very petty. )))) 

  
  
  "There were many reasons in the last 4 months why they were not paying me for the work finished in January, they eventually paid the invoices in April two weeks apart." 
  
  The cheques were prepared for March 26th. You keep saying you had installed a functioning camera system in January and this may technically be true as far as the hardware goes. But you knowingly prevented us from testing or using the camera system by denying us a password to access the system until you received full payment. This dodgy business practice effectively rendered the system useless between January and April and is one of the main reasons the payment was held back. To date we have received no operation manual or instruction on using the system. Having said that, this has nothing to do with delivering our laptop & fobs and returning our keys and remote.

   

  (((( When I was contacted about the Vagrant that was in the building, I sent the password to the property manager. There was no other conversation about accessing the DVR, or an orientation with anyone about the system. If you refuse to communicate with the installer, how do you expect to set anything up? ))))

  
  
  "The complainant will need the computer along with the FOB's to properly install them into the system to have it work properly. This is something that will be done after the exchange of the 10% final payment with the laptop and fobs. You can't use the FOB's without the computer and vise versa." 
  
  We know we need these things to use them. Please deliver them.
  
  "The change over will need to be at the end of June rather than the second week in June. I will let the Property Management company know this new turnover time as well as the complainant. When I click on the original complaint and I read over it, it is another fallacy stretching truth and comments that were never made. It appears that the complainant will say anything to make himself look like a victim." 
  
  The complainant IS the victim of unreasonable delays, broken promises and unmet deadlines. Here you have introduced yet another delay. First upon payment, then mid June now the end of June and in the future maybe by Christmas! 
  
  "There was no request for price increase, there was no 2 years of waiting, there was no install starting in 2019, there was not even an excuse as to why it wasn't started. I'm looking forward to this next complaint and what wonderful nonsense will be written down to further his pursuit to discredit my company."
  
  There are documents attached to this complaint that are dated September 2019 which is when strata became involved with your company and begin to document all of this. I agree that no install was started in 2019 (other than the installation of the entry phone). No other work was begun until November 2021 when the BBB was contacted. Future readers can review the attached documents to see when the contract was commenced and see that it is still "in progress" years later.

   

  (((( So if you agree that it was 1 year and not 2 years. YOUR COMPLAINT SAYS SEPTEMBER 2019 TO SUPPLY AND INSTALL SECURITY SYSTEM. This is an absolute lie that you admit to and you stated on your original complaint, so you lied about your original complaint right at the start. One year and Two years are a big difference, so you admittingly lied about the time line. The quotes were authorized in October 2020 and I was paid the down payment in December of 2020. The telephone entry system was installed in January 2021 and then I needed an amount for proximity fobs to purchase for the installation of the access control system (card readers). The first response I got for an amount for Fobs was in April of 2021 for the amount of 100 tags. Your Strata has 52 suites plus other trades and by my 25 years of experience, you are short by about 300 fobs. The access control system was purchased in January of 2021 and was ready to install. Your warranty started in January of 2021 and I still have an amount that doesn't make any sense. I never got an honest answer and still haven't until one of your Strata members threatened to contact BBB if I didn't give back the down payment. Nothing mentioned about installing the system, they just wanted the money back for someone else to install. There was no question about our company installing the system, just an angry letter that was very threatening. The letter was in October and I had started the installation in mid November and was done the first week of January. Your last complaint was December threatening that I needed to be done on a certain date, and I told you weather permitting. So fast forward to mid April when I get paid and two weeks later I get another complaint. I give you a date and it's not good enough?. You're waiting 6 weeks and I waited how long to be paid? 15 weeks? Now I will have to take you to court to receive the last of the payments and you're wondering what's taking so long? ))))

   

  
  
  This complaint is not about discrediting your company; we'll leave that in your capable hands. You and your company either want to resolve these issues or you don't. Dragging this out week after week and month after month means more correspondence added to this complaint for future potential customers of yours to review. 
  
  This complaint is about resolving the outstanding terms of our contract. Namely: Deliver our proximity tags and programming laptop, return our keys and remote. We are not pursuing the camera positioning issues or even the drywall damage. We'd just like to receive the equipment we paid for in a reasonable period of time and not be subjected to ongoing unexplained delays and passed deadlines.

   

  (((( The camera position issue is not an issue, if you had told me before or during this installation and I ignored your requests, that would be an issue. If you refuse to communicate with me on the position of the cameras as well as the direction of the cameras, then that is your issue. I honestly have no idea what you are talking about with drywall damage regarding the installation. There was no drywall damaged during this installation, there were holes cut into the drywall for EMT conduit, splice box mounting and camera installation. There was also a 4" x 4" square cut into the roof to access the wall and this access point was covered by an access hatch. Again, communication needs to be present before you start accusing about what incorrect in your opinion. ))))

  ((((The fact that you lied about the original complaint to make it sound worse than it was just shows what type of person you are to deal with. The fact that you use this way of communication to try and discredit the company rather than just sitting down and talking about it shows how you deal with issues. You talk about me in my Van driving away from *** *. when he asked a question, is YOUR actions when dealing with anything about these installations. I had to look you up on Facebook to see what you looked like and I recognized you walking past me staring at your shoes. I had no idea what you looked like during this entire installation, and that is how you dealt with it. You complain about the cameras and the drywall after the fact rather than dealing with it during the installation. Everything you've complained about has been dealt with, including the laptop and fobs and yet, here you are throwing out false allegations, then admitting that they're false after I've responded to it. This is only dragging on due to your inability to communicate in the simplest form. ))))

   

  (((The fact that you lie and admit to it and you still seem to think we're a terrible company to deal with even though you've not dealt personally with anything. It's the weirdest thing I've dealt with in my 16 years of being in business. Thank you for teaching me on how to deal with an irrational person. ))))

  Customer response

  13/06/2022

  
  Complaint: ********
  
  I am rejecting this response because:

  As expected you've waited until the last possible minute to respond in order to delay as long as possible fulfilling your contract.

  Despite the litany of personal attacks in your last response over irrelevant details that you keep bringing up and which are unrelated to anything in this complaint we appear to be making progress. Hopefully you've dropped off our keys and garage remote by now as you said you would. Now maybe you can address the following points which form the basis of this complaint.

  Fact: The strata has paid for a laptop, software an access system and 100 programmed fobs. The payment for the laptop was cleared in March or April and the fobs were paid for in January. Months later neither have been delivered. 

  Fact: You have continually delayed the delivery date without reason. The only reason you give for not providing the fobs is that you don't think the 100 fob order is big enough. You keep saying there are 52 units in our building. There are not. You'd like the strata to increase the order size despite your not fulfilling the current order. It's unlikely this will be approved by council. 

  Please fulfill your contract. Strata's patience has run out. If the items are not delivered immediately the matter will be pursued through the CRT. 

   

   

   

   

   

   

  
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ******* ********

  Business response

  22/07/2022

  Additional Comments from Consumer:
   
  Complaint: ********
  
  I am rejecting this response because:
  As expected you've waited until the last possible minute to respond in order to delay as long as possible fulfilling your contract.
  Despite the litany of personal attacks in your last response over irrelevant details that you keep bringing up and which are unrelated to anything in this complaint we appear to be making progress. Hopefully you've dropped off our keys and garage remote by now as you said you would. Now maybe you can address the following points which form the basis of this complaint.
  Fact: The strata has paid for a laptop, software an access system and 100 programmed fobs. The payment for the laptop was cleared in March or April and the fobs were paid for in January. Months later neither have been delivered. 
  Fact: You have continually delayed the delivery date without reason. The only reason you give for not providing the fobs is that you don't think the 100 fob order isnt big enough. You keep saying there are 52 units in our building. There are not. You'd like the strata to increase the order size despite your not fulfilling the current order. It's unlikely this will be approved by council. 
  Please fulfill your contract. Strata's patience has run out. If the items are not delivered immediately the matter will be pursued through the CRT. 

   

  How do you reject a response?  How is it I have a litany of personal attacks that are irrelevant, yet your responses are fair? Your original complaint was based on a lie, so how is it irrelevant when I defend my Company from your fallacy? Your complaint has been based on misinformation that was told to you by everyone but myself. This complaint has been a waste of my time and a waste of the BBB time, due to the fact that each complaint you have brought forward could have been discussed over the phone like proper human beings. Instead, you've never phoned me or discussed anything to do with the three installations of three separate contracts. In fact, you haven't even emailed me about anything, nor has any of your Strata in regards to these three separate installations. 

  The day after this complaint was made, I had dropped off the keys, the laptop and the 100 fobs for 52 suites. Giving each of your residents under 2 fobs per suite. I have also added an extended warranty to your laptop so if anything should ever go wrong with it, you can contact me to have it fixed. 

  I have also programmed this laptop to be up to date with the OS and with the access control software, programmed in all your newly installed doors and entered all 100 fobs for your 52 suites. 

  I have sent the invoice in the following Monday (June 20th) to your Property Management company and it has been another 5 weeks without payment. I'm hoping it will not be another 4 months for you to pay us for our work. 

  I have fulfilled my side of this contract even through waiting for 4 and half months to get paid and the constant lies to make yourself feel like the victim. I have again finished my side of the contract the day after this complaint was entered into the BBB.  If this payment is not paid in a timely manor, I will be pursuing payment from this Strata through the Courts.  

   

  Kind Regards, 

  Jason M******

  Customer response

  25/07/2022

  
  Better Business Bureau:

  The business has now provided the invoiced items, final payment to the business has been authorized and the business has agreed to schedule a date next week to complete final setup of the system which is not currently functional. 
  

  
  I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ********, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me.
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ******* ********

*Some consumers may elect to not publish the details of their complaints, some complaints may not meet BBB's standards for publication, or BBB may display a portion of complaints when a high volume is received for a particular business. ↩