ComplaintsforJ & M Machine Company, Inc.

• Initial Complaint

  07/01/2024

  Complaint Type:

  Service or Repair Issues

  Status:

  Answered

  More info

  J&M Machine conducted an engine rebuild on a 2020 Cummins engine for us. After the initial startup, a severe knock was detected, which was diagnosed as an issue with the initial rebuilding procedure performed by J&M. The parts manufacturer spoke with **** from J&M Machine, who later conveyed to us that **** had not measured any specifications before assembling this engine. This could be due to inexperience or haste. Furthermore, we provided thousands of dollars' worth of parts that are now ruined after running for less than an hour. **** refuses to replace the damaged parts. We have been loyal customers of ****'s for years and have referred hundreds of clients to him. It is regrettable that it has come to this, but we are now faced with paying for thousands of dollars in damaged parts due to a lack of responsibility during the rebuild. His "no warranty" policy, which we did not sign and have never agreed to, should not excuse the lack of craftsmanship and responsibility. Instead of rectifying the situation, we were forced to retrieve our engine, along with the parts worth thousands of dollars, now thrown into buckets. I request reimbursement for invoice number #**** due to poor craftsmanship and a lack of responsibility.

  Business response

  07/01/2024

    For all who have the patience to read this and let it be known:
  
    JRB Performance brought us the work. This is the outcome for failed communication to specifically describe what they were building.
  Failed to tell us what the engine would be and what was expected of it.  No specific information was provided. You will notice in my email telling him so.

  He had provided such information in the past but not for this. We found this out after the engine failed.  After texting me and saying the engine ran great but was knocking. See picture enclosed.

  
  The injectors failed, Black death you will notice one cylinder is extremely black. He also mentions it in email and seeing it on his pistons pictures. One piston is scored other next to it isn't.
  Three cylinders failed and three were normal; if it was machine shop fault please explain as all cylinders are exactly same size as are pistons.
  This is an emission deleted engine and has a hot tune on it "illegal" which no one could explain to me how much fuel and timing was entering engine along with total boost.  We the machine shop Found this out after engine failed.
  JRB Performance provided us with all parts for this engine as I told them we arent going to markup parts that they could readily get from the dealer. 
  
  Putting stock replacement pistons in a high-performance engine, what do you expect for the outcome?
  When I called ***** Piston manufacturer to ask about clearance for the application, they said it would fail.
  
  Though it is not company policy to warranty short blocks or high-performance engines, we would have covered cost for machine work if he would supply pistons.
  He refused the offer; Now he will pay more money to have work done by the shop close to him which he had chosen not to do business with.
  I guess thats whats called poetic justice.
  
    Here is the email chain after the engine failed
  
  
  From: ******* <**************************************>
  Sent: Wednesday, June 19, 2024 10:58 AM
  To: '*****************' <*****************>
  Subject: RE: 5th gen ****************** JR:
      Had you sent me this page in the beginning we wouldnt be having this issue now.
  You have see both sides to understand.
   You brought up the ****** example, all information was provided on a sheet and I file fit and sized pistons accordingly.
  
  Cut and dry.  You Did Not provide any information regarding horsepower etc  other than saying, Compound turbos doesnt mean anything to us.
  
     I am going to cover the cost of the tear down and machine work and reassembly of short block.
  I shouldnt have to do any of this as there is NO Warranty on short blocks, especially anything performance.
  But I am.
  
  ****
  
  
  
  
  
  From: ***************** <*****************>
  Sent: Tuesday, June 18, 2024 11:13 AM
  To: ******* <**************************************>
  Subject: Fwd: 5th gen **************** clear="all">
   ****************
  Owner /President
  JRB PERFORMANCE & CUSTOMS LLC 
  
  Main:************ 
  Store support: Contact Us JRB Customs Shop 
  Address:***********************************
  
  
  
  ---------- Forwarded message ---------
  From: ****** waglercompetition.com <****************************>
  Date: Tue, Jun 18, 2024 at 10:27?AM
  Subject: RE: 5th gen ********* To: ***************** <*****************>
  
  1000-1100hp street fighter specs
  
  .0055 - ***** piston to wall clearance
  
  Mains line bore/hone ***************
  
  ENGINE MUST BE HONED WITH A TORQUE PLATE
  
  BEARING SPECS
  Main bearing clearance - ***** - *****
  Rod bearing clearance - ***** - *****
  Thrust bearing end play .004 - .006
  
  
  It depends what ring pack you are using on the 2nd ring. Most the time the 2nd ring just drops in. If you want to give me the number off the 2nd rings  I can give you the spec. most the time they are in the .035-.045 range
  
  The top ring I would set at .025-.026
  
  I would replace the oil cooler also cause im sure there is junk in it from it being too tight
  
  
  
  
  Thanks,
  
  ***********************
  ****** Competition Products
  9612 N 675 E
  Odon, IN 47562
  ************
  
  
  From: ***************** <*****************>
  Sent: Tuesday, June 18, 2024 8:12 AM
  To: ****** waglercompetition.com <****************************>
  Subject: 5th gen *********
  Hey man good morning, 
  
  To add onto our convo last week, this is what the top end looks like with less than 2 hours run time. To recap - it's bored 20 over, we have your rods, cam and also purchased these pistons through you. ***** was having that "fuel knock" at idle. Looks to us that cyl one blew right by the rings either from over fueling or a clearance issue from the machine shop.I had asked our machine shop where he set the rings at and he specified that the mfg told him to not file fit them? Does this sound correct? Do you think it has anything to do with the hone finish? 
  
  I think we need to send these injectors back out to S&S to get charted, looks like it was fueling hard and getting hot. Please input your thoughts with these photos... 
  
  Thanks guys 
  
   *****************
  Owner / President
  JRB PERFORMANCE & CUSTOMS LLC 

  Customer response

  07/02/2024

   
  Complaint: 21917476
  
  I am rejecting this response because the email chain and JM's reply do not clarify why the failure occurred with less than an hour of run time. Their "no warranty" clause, which we were unaware of and did not agree to, does not excuse the lack of responsibility and craftsmanship. The parts manufacturer confirmed to me that JM had absolutely no record of setting the correct specifications, which led to the engine's failure upon startup. While we initially suspected a fuel issue, having trusted JM for many years, the discovery of significant metal debris in the oil filter indicated otherwise. Subsequently, we were informed that we were liable for the cost of parts amounting to thousands of dollars. We were told it was a tuning issue related to fuel, despite the fact that these truck injectors are non-adjustable and were verified as faultless by the manufacturer. The picture provided clearly shows a rounded-off crankshaft main bolt, suggesting ***** assembly or negligent craftsmanship. Additionally, I have already had to purchase new parts costing $1,000, as shown above to ********************** Another $1,200 will be required for the replacement of parts damaged by **. I am requesting full reimbursement due to the poor craftsmanship and the resulting damage to the parts we paid to have installed correctly.
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ***********************

  Business response

  07/03/2024

  The best thing I can suggest to you is do what I did.

   I would suggest you call ***** North America ************** ask for tech support regarding the diesel pistons. 

  Without bias they will tell you that the stock pistons you bought from ******** don't fit your application. They don't make pistons for a 2019 6.7 engine.

  The pistons you bought were Stock replacement and were sized and machine work was done accordingly. 

  For your application they said you need forged pistons custom made for that horsepower and the injectors have to be set so they match the bowl of the piston. 

  if these steps aren't followed this is the result. These pistons cannot take the heat and stress of 3 times the compression along with that much power, they weren't designed for it.

  I asked them and you can too about extra clearance file fitting rings etc and their response was the same since it is a stock replacement piston the piston will not survive in this application.

  You are the victim of a poor salesperson that sold you those pistons promising you results that cannot be obtained by stock parts which don't fit your desired application. 

  If you still aren't convinced you can send the failed pistons to ***** and they will do a thermal inspection to show the pistons overheated and aren't designed to live in 1000 horsepower engine. 

  Since they are designed for stock replacement. 

  I doubt the injectors were set as the pictures show otherwise. You have multiple problems, but the machine shop is the easiest to blame. 

  Good luck to you. 

   

  Customer response

  07/08/2024

   
  Complaint: 21917476
  
  I am rejecting this response because: ****, I would advise against blaming a performance shop with over 60 years of experience for issues with these parts. ****** has been sending those pistons for YEARS. Moreover, if ***** informed you that these were not the "correct" pistons, why proceed with the installation? Perhaps you failed to give them the correct piston information? From what we are seeing and what ****** is telling us, they have seen this issue only when there is a MACHINE SHOP error! You seem to forget that this engine ran for less than an hour without any load or boost. How could there be a severe internal failure when the truck was driven less than a mile before returning to my shop with obvious engine noises? Your responses are irrelevant and demonstrate a lack of understanding and responsibility in this matter. I am seeking some form of reimbursement for the cost of the parts that were destroyed due to the installation of pistons that you were informed were not "correct". Furthermore, there were more issues found such as the main bearing tolerances and the main cap bolts being rounded off, it's absolutely unacceptable. You failed to reach out to the actual supplier to verify the information before performing YOUR job, sir.  
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ***********************

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