ComplaintsforArsenal Inc.

• Initial Complaint

  11/22/2022

  Complaint Type:

  Service or Repair Issues

  Status:

  Answered

  More info

  Purchased rifle on January 4th 2022, observed excessive and abnormal wear under normal use, reached out to the company in early October 2022, was advised to submit RMA request for warranty service and did so on October 14th 2022. Since then *** received improbable excuse after excuse as to why they arent processing my request for warranty service each time I follow up. **************** Representative claims via email hes being kept in the dark about whats going on. Still no resolution or proposed resolution as of November 21st 2022.

  Business response

  12/01/2022

  I called and spoke with the customer today. He purchased an ********************** ***-5 rifle and it has an issue which several customers have had with this model of rifle.

  Our customer service person had requested an RMA number so that the customer could return his rifle to ********************** in ********* for warranty repair. However, this rifle was manufactured by Arsenal in ******** and we didn't have the necessary parts at the time locally to make the repairs. Additionally, the employee that was responsible for issuing RMA numbers is no longer working here and RMA's got backed up and delayed. We are sending out an RMA to the customer by tomorrow and will repair or replace this customer's rifle with the same model.

  These are not good excuses, but this is what happened. I have provided my direct contact information to the customer so he can contact me directly regarding this matter. I will follow up on this until the customer has a great ***-5 rifle in excellent working condition. 

  Customer response

  12/02/2022

   
  Complaint: 18445920
  
  I am rejecting this response because: 

   

  I was assured via phone and email that an *** would go out to me today or tomorrow by a gentleman named ****. The *** did not go out to me by the promised deadline. I still dont have it. The stated issue of manufacturing in ******** also doesnt align with previous excuses provided by Arsenal (alleged lack of Wi-Fi at a trade show, etc). Which one is it really? They claim to not have enough employees to address customers defective rifles but continue to somehow produce and ship new rifles.
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ****************

  Business response

  12/20/2022

  The same day I learned about this customer's issue, I immediately requested that an RMA (return authorization) be issued to him so he could return his rifle to Arsenal Inc. for repair or replacement. I also immediately called and spoke to him about the problem and have continued to communicate with him many times, including today. An RMA was issued and sent to the customer within a day or so after I first talked to him and he returned his rifle to Arsenal Inc. about a week or so ago. As I explained to the customer, there is a known over-gassing issue with the SAM5 rifle which was manufactured in ********. Arsenal Inc. in *********, ** did not manufacture his rifle. We are the **** distributor of the rifle.

  I explained to the customer that we are waiting for parts and/or new rifles from the manufacturer in ******** to repair or replace his rifle. I understand his frustration. I would be upset too. 

  Previously, Arsenal in ******** didn't know how to immediately resolve this issue with the *** 5 rifle and the customer service employee that the customer spoke to in the past probably didn't want to take this customer's rifle back for repair or replacement when we had no parts or replacement rifles from the manufacturer. I'm not making any excuses for what happened in the past, but I am following this up every day until this customer's rifle gets repaired or replaced.  

  Customer response

  12/23/2022

   
  Complaint: 18445920
  
  I am rejecting this response because:
  

  To be absolutely clear on the **** I was repeatedly assured during the aforementioned phone call and follow-up email that I would receive it today or tomorrow on December 1st. However, I did not receive it until December 6th, and only after taking the initiative to reach out about it yet again on December 5th. 

  
  Now Im being told that theres a holdup on getting replacement parts/rifles from ********. Is that plausible? Sure. However one would have to pardon me for being skeptical of it considering the long list of excuses Ive received from Arsenal previously. In that context, it just reeks of yet another excuse. 
  

  Arsenal ******** does indeed manufacture these rifles. However its Arsenal in ********* who converts these rifles into their final form for the ** market and offers and handles the warranty. 
  

  Just as ** consumers dont call the factory in ***** when they have an issue with their iPhone, and dont call the factory in ***** when they have an issue with their ****** vehicle, the concept of Arsenal ********* trying to pass the buck to Arsenal ******** is a little absurd. 
  

  While I sincerely believe that the gentleman handling this BBB complaint at Arsenal ********* means well, I will continue to reject these responses I receive one of the following: 

  A properly-manufactured, properly-assembled, defect-free ***-5 rifle that I will throughly inspect, function test with a minimum of 500 rounds of ****mm ammunition, then thoroughly inspect again to ensure there are no problems. 
  

  Or

   

  A check for $2,063.94, which would be a refund of what I have invested in the rifle as well as reimbursement of the cost of shipping the rifle back to Arsenal in ********* from ************. 
  

  Sincerely,

  
  ****************

  Business response

  01/31/2023

  Arsenal Inc. in ********* did not manufacture the parts that are causing problems with this customer's rifle. We definitely do honor the warranty and will be sending this customer a brand new rifle in good working order. I emailed the customer yesterday to let him know. 

  Customer response

  02/10/2023

   
  Complaint: 18445920
  
  I am rejecting this response because:

  As indicated in the attached screen shot from January 13th, I was told I was receiving a brand new rifle from ******** and it was implied that the delay was a result of waiting for said rifle to arrive. What I ended up receiving is a rifle with a 2021 date code. Considering that the 2021 year rifles are notorious for being the worst ones for the overgassing issue, this inspires no confidence, and Arsenal refuses to be transparent about what difference, if any, there might be with this rifle, and there are no observable differences. Of note, however, is that magazine fitment is much worse than the previous rifle I sent in. The few extra items as promised were not thrown in (obviously not a huge deal, but being lied to on that front is kind of annoying). 

  I was given $50 store credit at Arsenals sister company, K-Var, but it can only be used on Arsenal brand products, and considering that the cheapest Arsenal product at K-Var that might be of any use to me at K-Var is $52.99 before shipping, Id have to spend more of my own money in order to receive any kind of compensation for this months-long fiasco. Not impressed. 
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ****************

  Business response

  03/02/2023

  The replacement rifle that was sent to this customer is brand new and has never been used. Not all rifles manufactured in 2021 had over-gassing problems and the customer does not say that there are any over-gassing problems with his new replacement rifle.

  Regarding the problem with the magazine (which he doesn't specify), if he can take a video of the problem with his phone and send it to us, I can find out how we can resolve it. He didn't say what type or brand of magazine he is using in the rifle.

  This is the third BBB complaint submitted by this customer and I have replied to each one of them. He has complained extensively on social media as well and argued with our employees on social media and elsewhere. I'm not sure if he can be satisfied. I understand that he was upset about the delay in getting a new rifle. I don't blame him at all. He is entitled to complain if he has legitimate problems. As mentioned previously, we are not the manufacturer of the rifle.  

  The customer was not "lied to" about receiving something for the delay. He's just not satisfied with what he received. I understand his logic and will see what we can do to hopefully make him less unhappy about this. A customer service rep will contact him about this by tomorrow.   

   

  Customer response

  03/16/2023

   
  Complaint: 18445920
  
  I am rejecting this response because:

   

  It is now March 16th and no one from Arsenal has reached out regarding the continued issues with the replacement SAM5. It was stated that this would take place by tomorrow on March 2nd. I think Ive given them ample time to reach out and this did not occur. I was clearly told they would throw in a few things for my troubles and that turned into a convoluted voucher program that wouldnt even cover a single thing, which makes the throw in a few things statement untrue.
  

  I did not file 3 separate BBB complaints. Ive simply rejected 3 responses to the original complaint so far because a satisfactory resolution hasnt been provided. 

  As for complaints on social media, many people have shared their thoughts on social media about what has turned out to be poor experience owning a SAM5. Im far from the only one. This was discussion was eventually compounded by very slow and lackluster customer support. This is inevitable when people spend approximately $2,000 on a product and it turns out to be sub-standard and then they experience poor customer service when they seek a resolution. 
  

  I have owned Arsenal rifles in the past, and never had any issues with those rifles or with Arsenal as a company prior to this SAM5, so to say it wouldnt be possible to make me happy is pretty far from reality. Ive only ever wanted what Ive come to expect from Arsenal based on previous ownership experiences, and that is an outstanding quality rifle that functions perfectly. 

  On February 10th I did mention to Arsenal customer service that I was having fitment issues with Arsenal Circle 10 magazines in the replacement rifle as shown in the attached screen shot. I used the common abbreviation of ((10)) for them. This is the proper factory magazine for the rifle. 
  

  On February 13th, as shown in the attached screenshots, I did express concern and attached photos after firing the rifle of what appeared to be a similar overgassed wear pattern at the rear of the receiver. I also mentioned an alignment issue with the front sight. Arsenal **************** asked for an additional photo and inquired what type of ammunition I was using- to which I replied with the photo and that I was using proper factory-made ****mm ammunition. They never got back to me on that. 
  

  I have since accepted someones offer to buy the rifle just to get rid of the headache at a considerable financial loss and move on to something else. 
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ****************

  Business response

  04/03/2023

  The replacement rifle sent to the customer has a warranty, so he can send it back for repair if he wants to. But he says he is selling the rifle. We have replied to this customer's complaint and follow-up correspondence around 4 or 5 times and sent him a new replacement rifle. I'm sorry for the issues he had, but we consider this matter closed unless he wants to send the replacement rifle to us for warranty repair.

  Customer response

  04/04/2023

   
  Complaint: 18445920
  
  I am rejecting this response because:

   

  I told Arsenal on February 13th, 2023 that there were issues with the replacement rifle. I gave them a full month to take the rifle back for warranty service, and they never did, and never addressed or responded to my concerns with the replacement rifle. I proceeded to sell the rifle at a significant loss on March 13th, 2023 after Arsenal made no effort to address the issues or honor their warranty. 

   

   

  
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ****************

• Initial Complaint

  08/30/2021

  Complaint Type:

  Service or Repair Issues

  Status:

  Resolved

  More info

  Arsenal sold me a defective product. They've also refused to warrantee or help me with the product. It's completely defective directly from the manufacture the finish of the item has completely worn away and it turns a bright white and orange any time I use the item. And if you own items like this you know that that is highly unusual an abnormal. The vendor has admitted that this is unusual but has denied my warranty claim given the location where I live. I filed a small claims case against the business for remedy. awful customer service told me they won't help me because of where I live.

  Business response

  03/22/2022

  Consumer Response /* (2000, 10, 2021/09/16) */ The complaint has been resolved. Arsenal honored the warranty. Thank you.

*Some consumers may elect to not publish the details of their complaints, some complaints may not meet BBB's standards for publication, or BBB may display a portion of complaints when a high volume is received for a particular business. ↩