ComplaintsforNathaniel's Construction

• Initial Complaint

  11/03/2023

  Complaint Type:

  Product Issues

  Status:

  Unresolved

  More info

  Dear Better Business Bureau, We hired Nathaniel's Construction on Olean Rd East Aurora, whom you have listed as an A+ accredited member of the BBB for 3 years, to put an addition on our home. We found them at the Buffalo Home Show. Our original quote we received was on May 12, 2023 for $63,000. We did make a few changes to our plans and never received any updated prices despite asking for them for 6 weeks. We received an updated quote only a few days (right before July 4th) before construction was supposed to begin. The updated price went up to $157,049 (250% increase) with many glaring discrepancies from the original. We put down a deposit of $20,000 in May when we signed the original contract. Construction was supposed to begin July 12th. The new quote was received June 29th. We have made several requests for a full refund since no work was done, no materials were ordered, or paid for (even though they said they were from multiple suppliers) and nothing has been received. We have not heard anything from them since July 7th. A Lawyer has mailed 2 letters to Nathaniel's Construction with no reply. I see on a ****** review posted 2 days ago, that they owe 54k to a business that loaned them money. This tells me that they have a habit of this, as this is two people/companies that I know of. Please help us receive our deposit back and help prevent him from taking advantage of more unknowing future victims. Yours sincerely, **** *** ***** ********

  Business response

  11/06/2023

  I attached the letter as we are in conversations with there attorney they are not happy that we could not do the original scope of work for the amount we originally discussed after weeks of changes and add ons. The reviews she is quoting that we owe others money we are in a lawsuit with a former employee that is disgruntled and for the last 3 weeks has been posting negative reviews. This complaint is not valid 

  Customer response

  11/06/2023

  I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ********, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint.   We have asked multiple times for them to provide proof they ordered and paid for the materials they have said they did. They said that they are "confidential."  We have also asked multiple times for their attorneys information that apparently is going to sue us for "defamation", as we would like to give the attorneys name and information to our attorney and they simply ignore that request repeatedly.  We have never denied asking about changes. We have always done it asking "how much would it cost to do x, y or z?"  each time. We never got those estimates,  it was always "that will just be a little more, not much". They were just added in. No change orders written up with amounts. As we were trying to figure things out, after they sent the new contract with everything added in, they sent us a "ceast and desist" and that told us they didn't want to do this job. That was when I contacted a lawyer and she recommended that we request a refund.  They are not happy that we know that they never paid a deposit on, ordered, or paid for the garage door they claim was paid for. That they also never ordered the lumber, only paid for the calculation of what would be needed for the project.  These are underhanded and not good business practices.    Regards,  ***** *** **** ********

  Business response

  11/08/2023

  We have never said we did not want to do the job. Quite frankly the opposite happened we were very much excited to do this as you see we put alot of time and effort into the project before even commencing the manual labor. The cease and desist was given after two of my suppliers called and stated the homeowners were calling multiple times harassing then. We in no way said lumber was ordered, we didn't get a large enough deposit for lumber. The project changed from a simple pole barn to an elaborate full exterior remodel with an addition of living space and pole barn. Everytime there was a change we would ask for there budget we would be told "we have savings and a loan". We never truly received a number but adding on three times the amount of work and materials you would think you would expect the number to increase. When the home owners picked materials, we suggested a few times a lower end budget friendly price with some excuse not to use it for example the stone, the homeowners wanted real stone I offered a good compromise of vinyl stone for half the cost I was shot down with "no it looks cheap, my sister inlaw has this and it's fine til up close". They kept asking for numbers on the project changes but kept changing their minds on the product. We changed siding 3 times and roof 4 then added stone.  I think it is common sense residing and roofing an entire house is expensive, we would not of had to do those had the client not changed the electric (moved and added on solar panels) or scope of the work. As stated we are happy to go back to the original contract with the simple pole barn, re board the rear deck and laundry room but in no way can we  Re side the house Roof the full house New soffit and fascia  New gutters  Remove door (repair work) Add a overhang in the front of house by the door to exsisting garage all of the electrical (Lighting, outlets, sub panels, removal and reinstall solar panels and now and more solar panels) Build a pole barn Build an up to code living space  A roof overhang  And a 40 by 20 composite deck   For 63000  I have given discounts and cost break down I have showed materials ordered while the homeowners were at my residence on father's day and they said they liked the door. They picked out and left the garage door company with the design of the door they choose.  (I wasn't even present they just walked in and demanded to be taken care of) no appointment or warning  I am willing to do whatever I need to do to solve this but at this time I am going to but a ucc lien on the property for the exsisting contract of 63000 until the false negative reviews are removed  

  Customer response

  11/10/2023

  We have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ********, and have determined that this does not resolve our complaint.  \  Regards,  ***** *** **** ********  

  Business response

  11/13/2023

  We have responded and completely communicated with this client. We have forwarded the letter sent to them explaining all of the concerns and reasons for price change. This complaint is not valid due to the scope of work change. They are sharing false information about the project outlined in the previous attachment is the outline of correspondence and they already agreed they did change scope of work they are not denying that so with more work and premium materials picked this is the price given. We agreed to back to the original scope of work for the first price they said no 

  Customer response

  11/15/2023

  I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ********, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint.  Our questions have never been answered. No invoices provided. Please answer previous questions and statements that you have failed to respond to.   Regards, ***** ********  

  Business response

  11/16/2023

  I have blocked our personal information, this is dated and shown that everything in my letter is correct this is just the polebarn order not including the rest of everything they added on that we have quoted so as you see the quote we sent after all the changes is correct... I have given them breakdown cost of all changes. This complaint is due to them not being able to afford the changes of the original scope of work. I have said it plenty of times this is getting expensive what is your budget with a response of we have a loan and savings. After hearing back from all suppliers they are sticker shocked but changing from a simple polebarn to a full exterior remodel and addition is a huge change 

  Customer response

  11/19/2023

  I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ********, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint.  Still no invoice. Those are both quotes.  You still haven't shown anything was ordered or paid for. The Garage door that you said was ordered June 11th, has a file creation date of June 12th. You also stated on the 12th that "it was going into production tomorrow" (would have been in production June 13th then) and you said it was ordered and paid for later on June 12th along with a list of other items. According to the July 7th email, the garage door was still not ordered as you show here.  Also... that's not even our door. That's gray with no windows. It's supposed to be white with windows. We're attaching the photo ***** took June 12th at ******* ******** **** that you referenced earlier that she left with.  Multiple times you have stated that you have ordered and paid for over $15,000 worth of materials before July 7th. Still haven't seen any proof of that. Where's the proof?   ***** *** **** ******** 

  Business response

  11/21/2023

  More proof of the doors and windows. Those are not quotes where do you see quotes? These are orders. I'm not going back and forth you canceled the contract after months of changes and add ons. I have proof of meetings, text and emails of all the approved changes when you add on to the project it changes your price. If you look at original scope to now you added on a months worth of work. I would be willing to go back to original contract you said no do not come to the house so it states in the contract the deposit is non refundable if you cancel after 3 days. 

  Customer response

  11/24/2023

  I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ********, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint.  If you say these are orders and not quotes, Then why was nothing delivered in July?  If you say you wanted to do the job, then why was there NO communication from you after you sent the "cease and desist"? It doesn't add up to you wanting to do a job 5 days later.  Also, Purchase Orders have PO #s or invoice numbers. These have none where they should be.  The windows that you are claiming that are for us aren't even the right number of windows or the right size! There should have been 4 - 2'x3', 1 - 2'6"x4', and 1 - 3'x4'8". Plus a replacement window. You said on June 12th that they were ordered and paid for. This quote wasn't even made until June 15th. See the screenshot attached of what you wrote us!  Stop lying. Just give us our money back.   Regards,  ***** ********

  Business response

  11/28/2023

  We agreed to changing the window sizes, as so it would look esthetically better. I have nothing to hide here I have done everything to keep you in the loop when you have made changes over and over and have messages emails and invoices showing that we have done alot of work to get you this build. After adding all this work to the original scope you couldn't afford the changes and decided to cancel. I never said I wouldn't go back to the original scope. You said no. The reson for the cease and desist was that you were calling our suppliers many times a day and they threatened to stop doing business with us so the cease and desist states to only speak with Nathaniel to work something out and you asked for your deposit back. The contract states after 3 days your deposit is not refundable. I have tried to be reasonable but this is not remotely correct. You guys made changes I updated the contact to reflect the changes. After asking many times for budget and not being told one I couldn't advise as a professional what we could and couldn't do so I gave you the invoice of everything you asked for. I have met you everytime you have asked, changes made accordingly, I have responded day and night this got out of had after you received your updated invoice, all that had to be said was we can't afford all the changes let's look into what we can do our budget is xxxxxx

  Customer response

  02/15/2024

  When were the window sizes changed? Why would we make that drastic of a change to  something that we had designed with our architect? Without it being in writing. Anywhere.   Especially with the fact that this change is for a variety of sizes and the number of  windows. You never had a piece of paper to write anything down with you. You only took a  picture of siding with your phone. Never took any notes. Nothing. We're still not sure  when it came about that we were supplying the drywall. Still completely baffled about  that.  The images that you sent aren't invoices either. Those are quotes. Until there is  something with a PO# or Invoice #, we stand by that statement.  Each time we asked about a change, it was "IF we did xxxx or yyyy how much would that   be?" Never a for sure "this is what is happening" except for the electrical with the  Electrician. That was needed since you didn't even have him quote more than 1 outlet  and light switch for a garage or living space.  You assumed that we didn't have a budget. When we saw the original price we said "we  can do this with what we have and the HELOC can do the concrete." Then as we were  discussing things, and not getting pricing, we said that we might have to wait to do the  concrete until next year, pending if we do any changes and how much they are.  Why  should I be forced to give a "number"? You give us a number and we say yes or no. The  first number was reasonable.  As for "harassing multiple companies" as you claim, ***** only made those calls to protect the company and our money just in case. ***** called ** ****** a grand total of 3 times over 3 separate days (July 3, July 4, July 6), because she was told on the first call that "nothing was ordered, but that **** was who she needed to talk to in case something was different than they could see in the computer." She was told to call back. She did as instructed. He wasn't there then either. Again the next open day. She left a message for him with her number. Never heard from ****. So she left a message on July 6th to not order anything for our job unless he hears from us at that time. We weren't sure what was happening as communication with you was spotty at best at that time. That's not harassing a business. That's protecting them and us.  ***** called ******* ******** **** asking for **** as that is who you told her to see on the 12th of June. He was the designer. He wasn't available or had left for the day, she asked for him to call her back and left her number.  He called her on July 6th at 2:42pm and that is when they had the shocking conversation about our door that was never ordered, since "no deposit was ever made by us with you" for a whole 3 minutes and 45 second phone call. How is that harassing? You lied. We are calling you out on it. We can't trust you. Why would we want you to come to our house and do work? As stated before MULTIPLE times, if you actually wanted to do the job and actually ordered materials, you would have contacted us after the request for our money back. You did no such thing even with receiving 2 letters from a lawyer.   

  Business response

  02/15/2024

  Hi so it has been weeks since you have responded, i have sent you everything you have requested. You giving new drawings and picking out material and having us meet multiple times with months of phone calls and changes is an approval. If you could not afford the changes as we stated multiple times we would be happy to go back to the original contract and not change to siding, not do the roof, not build an extremely large deck, not build a roof over hang, not build a front door overhang, not change the existing garage into a bedroom. When you sent new plans you approved the changes. We would of worked with you to do things the following few years but no you started calling suppliers. You told us to cancel the contract and return your deposit without speaking to us stating you could not afford to do this or that which we would of worked with you. Since we always answered and we always responded sometimes up to 11pm. We never received "2" notices from your attorney we received "1" and I sent the same letter you already read and received. The windows where changed and approved when we added one more window and discussed the windows your architect has in the design is going to make it look very industrial. I have done everything I can to make this process smooth but in your contract it states you forfeit your deposit after 3 days. You have made vast changes from our first meeting and I always responded with what is your budget that's a big change this is getting expensive. I could not get you numbers because every other day you made a change. It was weeks to wait for new plans the sending off for take off then again more changes and on fathers day again more changes so it took awhile to compile changes and come up with a number. If the number did not work you just had to respond with I can not do this now how about we try to get the number to our budget x what can we do, instead you canceled the contract. You signed it stating and understanding you would not receive your deposit back if you canceled after 3 days.  If we had no intentions on doing your project I would of never sent my electrician, never sent out for take off never met multiple times never answered your calls and texts. All you had to do was have a conversation of what you could afford and what you wanted to do later on. 

  Customer response

  02/19/2024

  I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ********, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint.       The previous response was sent to the BBB December 3rd. The entire conversation was “under review by management” at that time though. I'm not sure if you saw that or not. Why it wasn't sent earlier to you, I have no control over.      You have not sent everything we requested. We asked for pricing (even estimates) on different parts multiple times throughout this process. We have asked to see paid invoices too.      The “new drawings” were known that they were happening even before you wrote the initial contract. The “roof overhang” was discussed in advance of the contract being priced, yet you didn't price it originally.      The roof is the same as the original, only a different color of the same type of shingle. The deck was designed so it could be priced out for consideration. Doing siding to the whole house was your idea. We asked how much, you needed to know what products to price it, so we picked them out too. The existing garage was going to have alterations already, of which you thought wouldn't need heat and insufficient electric to it.      ***** called suppliers to ask when they were delivering to the job site, since you wouldn't respond for a few days and we needed info to get the time off of work. We were shocked when told there was nothing ordered as it was less than 2 weeks out from starting and materials were out 4-6 weeks.      We asked how it changed so much from the first contract. Items that hadn't changed from the first were drastically different in the second. For example, the roof.       When you sent a “cease and desist” instead of talking to us, that told us that you didn't want to talk to us. Then when we asked for our money back, you NEVER RESPONDED. That doesn't sound like you were willing to work with us at all. You never reached out until our ****** review was posted. Even though you received a letter from a lawyer.       As for the windows, the only change was adding one window. Which was in the plans. The sizes of the rest did not change. The only thing that would have looked “industrial” was metal siding and roofing on an addition attached to the current home. The windows were the same as the ones we already have on the house.      We never got to read the contract as it was on your phone and we didn't get it in advance. You never showed or said anything about a 3 day cancelation policy. You did say that you weren't worried about our check, so we didn't have to get a cashier's check like you have on your contract. You don't even follow what you write on it.      The only thing you did was send for take-off. Said you also ordered and paid for: windows and doors, and garage door. Never happened. No invoices.       Your punctuality and time management are awful. You didn't show up the first time we were supposed to meet. We had confirmed it 3 days prior. We had even changed our plans for that night. Then nothing from you for 3 weeks about rescheduling. You FINALLY came a month after you were originally going to come by to meet after we reached out to you.      The day we signed the contract you were 25 minutes late and you knew we were on a time crunch. ***** was over 30 minutes late to what she was supposed to do that day because of it. So you forced us to rush and pressured us to sign the contract to guarantee that you could do our project in 2 months time.      Nathaniel was supposed to come another day and didn't show up. Crystal finally showed that day and was over 45 minutes late. Never told us until she was here that he wasn't coming. Had the kids in the car because he was “sick at home” but couldn't communicate that before arriving the 45 minutes late.  The consumer called stating that the company coming back to their home was never an option.  They never did any work and they have hired another company.  Regards,  ***** *** **** ********

  Business response

  02/20/2024

  We have sent all invoices and my shop is full of materials you pick. You were told until take off was done that you would not have final price we have met and talked multiple times so this was definitely not rushed. I met at your property 4 times. I have responded to every text and call. The cease and desist was stated to discuss this with Nathaniel as the suppliers are not allowed to share information with clients for our confidential information and pricing. We asked you multiple times with every change you made for a budget as it was huge changes. You added on a ton of work. The entire project is a complete change. Nothing is the same besides size of pole barn. The roof is a complete tear off how is that not different the siding is a complete change because you wanted the front door out and garage door yes I can't tie into existing siding as they do not sell it which was discussed. You received our contract well before we even arrived and you had it printed in your binder. You had time to read it because you did mention the certified check and I said we trusted you I just won't order anything until it clears. I put alot of work and time into your build and you decided to cancel. The policy is clearly stated and it was above your signature. Yes we are allowed to get sick as I'm sure you are also and take days off from work. We have given you plenty of time to answer via email. Or a phone call... you choose not to. You said your lawyer sent out 2 letters which I can tell you we did not receive. I called the lawyer you stated sent letters with no response to our letter with documentation of charges. You have costed our company 10s of thousands of dollars. The review is incorrect and a deformation of character and harming my business. We have responded and tried to be  amicable and work with you but you are just going in circles saying you didn't change the project I have 3 months of text and meetings with all documented notes and pictures. I have suppliers recorded call. I have video proof of the garage door change, I have proof of siding picked and roof change 3 times. You could not come to a decision of your build and now that you have your price you can not afford you are deciding to cancel, unfortunately that is not how it works. We sit and discuss with you your budget to get you what is possible and come back around to do more later on but to cancel and post false reviews are harming my income, my business, my character and my family. If you would like I can have my lawyer and your lawyer talk but you signed the contract and took my phone and read it then I sent you a signed copy you confirmed you received and were able to read it. When I came back after that and you met at my house you never once had any issues til all your changes were final and you received the new bill

  Business response

  04/10/2024

  Hi so to wrap up our call this morning, I am going to send everything in this email.  First is the initial contract  Second contract  Drawing original  Drawings after changes Letter from their attorney  Letter from us to their attorney explaining all the changes times and dates made them Letter of cease and desist after harassment of suppliers  2nd notice after she put up a false review on ****** stating we did nothing for this project after months of meetings calls and texts Nathaniel's Construction never said we would not do the project we told her to reach out to Nathaniel directly as all of her changes she could not afford so we discussed going back to original contract she said no return her deposit do not come to her property. 

*Some consumers may elect to not publish the details of their complaints, some complaints may not meet BBB's standards for publication, or BBB may display a portion of complaints when a high volume is received for a particular business. ↩