ComplaintsforChim Kleen Chimney Service

• Initial Complaint

  04/04/2022

  Complaint Type:

  Service or Repair Issues

  Status:

  Answered

  More info

  I had a Chimney and Vermont Casting wood stove installed by Chim-Kleen as recommended by ******* (stove dealer) in *********. On November 8th, 2021 the chimney and stove were installed and, unfortunately, installed improperly and causing damage to my stove and home. A third party came and reviewed the installation and informed the wrong materials were used, was installed improperly and is actually a safety hazard. I first returned to Chim-Kleen to attempt to fix the problems.. After 2 different attempts, the problem was not fixed and now the project looks even worse. I attempted to utilize his insurance to file a claim, as he states and promotes "Fully Insured." I spoke with his insurance agent whom sent an adjuster and after 4 weeks of no progress, finally received a response that Chim-Kleen's insurance does not cover their work leaving me with a major issue. The cost paid was $2668.00. To have it fixed at this point is a MINIMUM of $4400 with probably more coming. I have attempted further contact with Chim-Kleen as well as his insurance, and they are now refusing to answer or make further contact. I contacted the dealer, ******* stoves in ********* and their sales rep, Todd. He stated he had a request to get the insurance information from Chim-Kleen prior to this situation and had never received the information for months yet continued to recommend Chim-Kleen for installations. I am not at a loss of where to go or help to request. I am asking the BBB to intervene and assist. Thank you.

  Business response

  04/11/2022

  To whom it may concern;
  
  On November 8, 2021, I installed a ******* ******** ***** *** ******* for Mr. R*** *******. I used appropriate parts for a metal roof install that were purchased from **** **** ********* (Invoice and Parts List Attached.) The install went seamlessly, zero issues. 
  
  I received a call from Mr. ******* the following week in which he stated that he had some leaking around the chimney pipe. I went back to Mr. *******’s house on November 15th to inspect. I noted no leaks, there was no where around the flashing that any leak could be coming from causing his issue. Out of an abundance of caution, I resealed the flashing. I noted during this inspection that Mr. ******* has no roof vents. I advised Mr. ******* that because the leak was not occurring with rain, only with use of the stove, that I believed this was a condensation issue. With no roof vents, there is no where for the heat to go creating condensation. Mr. ******* thanked me for my time and I was on my way. I did not charge Mr. ******* for services.
  
  I received another call from Mr. ******* a few weeks later. He stated that it was still leaking around the chimney, that no leak was occurring with rain still. I went back to Mr. *******s home on December 5th. Again, I reinspected my work, noted no leaks around the chimney or from the installation itself. I resealed the flashing again for Mr. *******, for his peace of mind. I advised Mr. ******* that this issue was not related to the chimney itself, that he definitely had a condensation issue. I advised him that he should get in contact with a roofing professional, as vents and some additional insulation in the roof box should correct the issue he was experiencing. At the time of inspection, I noted there was condensation on all of his windows too. I took pictures for my records of the condensation and pointed it out to Mr. ******* when discussing contacting a roofing professional. Again, I did not charge for services rendered.
  
  Over the next few weeks, I heard nothing from Mr. *******. However, I was contacted by a business associate who informed me Mr. ******* was preparing to file an insurance claim and telling people that I wasn’t returning his calls. From December 5, to January 28th I never received any sort of communication from Mr. ******* and am happy to provide phone records to prove that. 
  
  I heard nothing from Mr. ******* himself until January 28th. Mr. ******* then “forwarded” an email he sent on December 20th that we never received; it had gone to our spam folder. I spoke to him on the phone and he advised me that his schedule hadn’t allowed him to call via phone. During this phone call, he stated he had 2 different companies come out- 1 a roofing company, and 2 a chimney company. Both of which “stated” that the chimney was installed improperly, using illegal parts. This is false. The parts used come directly from a Chimney Supply Store (********) and the list is attached. The chimney was installed properly, up to code and with all manufacturer’s recommended clearances met.  He told me that it would cost him $3900 to have the chimney removed and reinstalled “properly” and the issues corrected. During the call, he requested a full refund of what I had charged ($2688.75), plus suggested an insurance claim for the money to have it removed and reinstalled by another company ($3900), yet failed to provide the parts list or written statements of what was “illegal”. I told him I was not comfortable providing a refund at this time because I believe it was a condensation issue, but that I was happy to provide our insurance companies information for them to investigate, and should I be found liable, have Mr. *******’s claim handled. He was happy with that road to having the situation rectified. 
  
  I contacted ***** *****, our insurance agent, that evening. I explained the information and let him know that he would be getting a call from Mr. ******* at some point. The official claim was filed with our insurance company, ***** *********, on February 17th.  I was advised from that point forward to let the adjuster and investigator handle communication with Mr. *******, which is exactly what I have done. 
  
  I have been provided a few updates from ***** ********* along the way, and Mr. *******’s claims continue to be false. We are insured, and our insurance company is attempting to work with him. However, they will not cover things that were not a result of the work we did and Mr. ******* is unhappy with the resolution that has been offered to him. 
  
  Furthermore, attached to Mr. *******’s complaint was a parts list provided and summary of what needed replaced from the new chimney company. As you can see, we used the same/very similar parts listed in the new quote, and the summary of “what we will do” acknowledges the venting issue and insulation issue with the roof as I suggested to the customer on 12/5. 
  
  We have made every effort to take care of Mr. ******* and will continue to work with our insurance company as they wrap up the claim. If I can be of any further assistance, please let me know. 
  
  Sincerely,
  Nick M****
  *****, Chim Kleen LLC
  
  

  
  

  
  
  

  Customer response

  04/11/2022

  I appreciate that Chim-Kleen produced a response, however, the documentation does nothing to satisfy this complaint. There was no response provided other than attached documents with no explanation. Chim-Kleen provided the following information:

  In regards to the installation bill: This is true as I was the one who also submitted this paperwork. This was the cost for parts and labor for the chimney. This does not meet the level of what I am requesting to fix the problem because payment for labor must be included to tear out the chimney as well as put in a new chimney properly. 

  
  

  In regards to my email I sent to Chim-Kleen: As you can see on the date, this was sent December 20, 2021. The price for repair was lower then because material costs have gone up. Also, it shows that 4 months have gone by and we still do not have a resolution. I did attempt to complete this in a way which did not include filing complaints and possible legal action, however, Chim-Kleen has failed to respond and provide any follow up or payment to rectify the problem.

  
  

  Chim-Kleen insurance document: It is just that. A document. However, when I filed a claim to have the chimney replaced, it was refused. I was informed that this insurance policy does not cover chimney installation, which Chim-Kleen is obviously completing, and stating they are "Fully Insured." Unfortunately, they are not insured to complete installs or else this would have been taken care of.

  
  

  The additional items attached do not serve any known purpose to this complaint. 

  
  

  I do not see anywhere in Chim-Kleen's response to my complaint and request for action in which they stated what they are going to do to rectify this incident. There is no explanation as to why each document was added or the intent or purpose of these documents. Chim-Kleen's insurance company/agent had been contacted more than 4 times over a month's time, with voice mails, and only responded recently when mandatory disclosure of company information was requested. They have been notified multiple times that their insurance states they are not covered for chimney installations. If Chim-Kleen is covered, then payment should be made reference the insurance claim. At this point, the only discussion point with the insurance adjuster was attempting to sell my current Vermont Casting Stove and work to buy me another one with an unknown delivery date, however, specifically EXCLUDED the chimney and roof.

  
  

  This can still be handled, as stated in my email, between company and client, however, with no action on the part of Chim-Kleen, I am not satisfied with their "response."

  
  After reviewing the letter, I find many problems with this letter. First,
  it is not accurate as the situation as it unfolded. When Chim-Kleen
  returned, he absolutely observed the water leaking issue and had it
  documented. In addition, he also received photographs. At the time of his
  return, damage was observed to the point that he contacted the dealer,
  ******* in *********, and attempted to order another stove top for my stove
  due to the damage. He did indicate that he believed it was a moisture
  issue, but I never stated that I was ok with that or that the installation
  was done correctly. For the type of roof and install we have, the venting
  he is talking about would not cause water INSIDE of the chimney. Also,
  there was not condensation issue PRIOR to the install of the chimney.
  
  Also, I have the documentation of multiple phone calls and the email as
  well. The email was sent to the email directly off of his website and
  business card. He indicated they don't normally check their email. Why
  would my email go into a SPAM folder if I am a customer? Phone calls were
  completed with no response and voice mails were left as I also have
  documented.
  
  Chim-Kleen talks about the supply list. I never said the supplies were
  wrong, however the install of supplies matter, not just the list of things
  used. I have previously attached the photographs of the chimney... if that
  looks right, show me another install that looks like this. Metal roofs need
  a metal flashing, not a rubber boot with a 1.5 inch splashing of silicone.
  The materials list is going to be very similar... but the way it is
  installed...WITH INSULATION, proper flashing and proper thickness is what
  matters.
  
  The letter states they will continue to work with their insurance to a
  resolution. No resolution is coming as they are not covered for chimney
  installations. This again, does not satisfy the incident. Chim-Kleen states
  that I was ok with the problem and just upset now. That is not the case. I
  was attempting to handle the situation as company and client, that is the
  only part that did not work.

   

  After reviewing the letter, I find many problems with this letter. First,
  it is not accurate as the situation as it unfolded. When Chim-Kleen
  returned, he absolutely observed the water leaking issue and had it
  documented. In addition, he also received photographs. At the time of his
  return, damage was observed to the point that he contacted the dealer,
  ******* in *********, and attempted to order another stove top for my stove
  due to the damage. He did indicate that he believed it was a moisture
  issue, but I never stated that I was ok with that or that the installation
  was done correctly. For the type of roof and install we have, the venting
  he is talking about would not cause water INSIDE of the chimney. Also,
  there was not condensation issue PRIOR to the install of the chimney.
  
  Also, I have the documentation of multiple phone calls and the email as
  well. The email was sent to the email directly off of his website and
  business card. He indicated they don't normally check their email. Why
  would my email go into a SPAM folder if I am a customer? Phone calls were
  completed with no response and voice mails were left as I also have
  documented.
  
  Chim-Kleen talks about the supply list. I never said the supplies were
  wrong, however the install of supplies matter, not just the list of things
  used. I have previously attached the photographs of the chimney... if that
  looks right, show me another install that looks like this. Metal roofs need
  a metal flashing, not a rubber boot with a 1.5 inch splashing of silicone.
  The materials list is going to be very similar... but the way it is
  installed...WITH INSULATION, proper flashing and proper thickness is what
  matters.
  
  The letter states they will continue to work with their insurance to a
  resolution. No resolution is coming as they are not covered for chimney
  installations. This again, does not satisfy the incident. Chim-Kleen states
  that I was ok with the problem and just upset now. That is not the case. I
  was attempting to handle the situation as company and client, that is the
  only part that did not work.
  
  Respectfully,

  
  **** *******
  

  Business response

  04/27/2022

  While we certainly understand Mr. *******'s frustration, we cannot acknowledge fault for the claims he's suggesting as they are certainly inaccurate. This installation was no different from any other metal roof installation, the only difference is Mr. *******'s roof is not properly vented as discussed in out first response. We have nothing further to comment at this time as solutions have been offered through our insurance company, they just aren't what Mr. ******* is wanting because what he has suggested is inaccurate. Please continue to work with the insurance company moving forward. 

  Thanks,

  Nick M****

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