ComplaintsforHohler Furnace & Sheet Metal, Inc.

• Initial Complaint

  06/02/2023

  Complaint Type:

  Service or Repair Issues

  Status:

  Answered

  More info

  Hohler Sheet Metal has left my family suffering without a functioning HVAC system since February. The unit went out under warranty while I had a maintenance agreement - Hohler canceled my maintenance agreement and told me that they didn't want to work with me. ******* ****** *** promised parts for repair, only to go back on his word. Would you trust and want to do business with this type of company? My ordeal has been going on for nearly 4 months. I have been a customer of Hohler for over 10 years and spent around $30K with them between installation of 2 premium Bryant Heat Pumps and annual maintenance. I had a maintenance agreement that cost around $700 per year. The equipment require several major repairs over the years and usually required multiple attempts - trial and error - to fix. I didn't expect to have so many the issues with these top of the line units but at least the warranty covered parts and the maintenance agreement covered labor costs. The last straw was when we discovered the Bryant Heat Pump unit encased in ice the day before the warranty expired. I was shocked because Hohler had come out two days before and said everything was fine, but I was relieved because the unit was still under warranty, and I notified Hohler immediately. They admitted that maintenance had not been done properly. Then Hohler canceled my maintenance agreement, told me that they didn't want to work with me, and tried to tell me that I canceled the agreement that covered my labor costs, which I didn't do. I have recordings of all conversations. I highly recommend that you stay away from Hohler and Bryant/Carrier. I have taped recordings, validating all of my claims. It's been nothing but a nightmare.

  

  Business response

  06/08/2023

   

  We have discussed your request internally and have come to the conclusion that we will no longer be able to service your HVAC

   See attached document.

  We also have copies of all emails and phone recordings if needed.

   Thank you for your time,

   **** ******

  Customer response

  06/20/2023

  Complaint: ********
  
  I am rejecting this response because:
  We had a relationship with Hohler for nearly 10 years.  We spent over $30,000 for a new system and many years of maintenance plans that were to cover labor in the event of an issue.
  Back in February when the last of many issues occurred, we had a warranty and a maintenance agreement.  Hohler's team came out to conduct maintenance and failed to catch any of the issues that were causing the unit to malfunction and freeze up. They gave us a report that stated the unit was in good working shape.  When we recorded the unit freezing up and called Hohler days later to inform them of the issue, they sent a technician out the next business day. Based on what he found, he stated that the unit was leaking and needed a new coil and a coolant refill.  When this was brought to my attention, I reminded the company that in 2021 they found a leak and being that this was the 2nd time in two years that the unit lost coolant/needed to be refilled, and the lubricant that lubricates the compressor is in the coolant, and being that the unit was running hot and freezing over due to sensors not shutting the heat pump down when it was low on coolant and stressed, I recommended that the compressor also be replaced.
  **** agreed to replace the compressor as well and told me at that time that even though I had a maintenance agreement that covered labor, they were willing to cover labor for the air coil/leak repair but not the labor for the compressor. A day later when I accepted his offer, he told me he would not honor it and would only replace the air coil and coolant due to there being no sign the compressor is damaged.  When I refused to settle for less than the original offer, I was told that Hohler didn't want to work with me anymore, to find another company, that my maintenance agreement was canceled, and that I canceled it. I did not cancel my maintenance agreement. It was my insurance policy to cover the labor for repairs. (Recordings and emails proving my statements are linked below). 
  It is now 4 months later. I have had several technicians look at the unit. One of the technicians performed a very simple acid test on the unit, by insert a paper tab into the unit's fluid. The acid test showed acid in the fluid and indicated the compressor is burnt out. He also found a floating clog due to contaminants in the coolant lines and determined that the blower ($1,600) is malfunctioning.  Hohler was the only company to provide installation, maintenance and repair on these units.  Also, Hohler and Bryant aren't concerned about repairing the sensors that are supposed to shut the heat pump down when it is encountering stress, like low pressure/leaks.  The unit burned so hot that the cover on top of the hardware melted.  
  Bryant, which was helping service the parts warranty, requested that we find another Bryant dealer to work with. All but one of the technician, we've had look at the unit in these months after Hohler canceled my family, including another Bryant dealer, said that it would be bad business to repair the unit and that it should be replaced.  I wrote an email to Bryant and CC'd Hohler on it with the technicians feedback. In his response to a review I posted on Yelp, **** responded that they offered me a "100% free repair" and that I refused it and demanded a new unit. I never demanded a new unit; the new unit data came into play months after Hohler offered the 100% free repair for the air coil only. 
  Based on the fact that they refuse to work with me and honor their commitments, I can't recommend Hohler as a HVAC company to work with and I reject their response.  They have let me and my family down by not honoring their word.
  Here is a link to a google drive folder with all the proof including taped phone calls, maintenance and repair receipts - ************************************************************************************
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ******* *********

  

  Business response

  06/22/2023

  See attachment for response.

  

  Business response

  06/22/2023

  [BBB Transcription via Attachment]
  We diagnosed the homeowners heat pump system and found a bad TXV Valve. Rather than just replace the defective valve we offered to replace the entire indoor coil. We were covering the coil warranty and he had to pay for labor, refrigerant and misc. materials. He was upset that we were charging him labor because he had a maintenance agreement with us. Most repairs are covered for labor under our plan but not refrigerant repairs which this fell under. Refrigerant repairs are labor intensive and require recovery, repair and evacuation time and we cannot justify covering this labor on a $350.00 maintenance agreement. He states that he pays $700.00. That is for two systems.
  The homeowner complained so we talked with our Bryant Distributor, and they were willing to pay for the labor and we had scheduled the coil replacement.
  The homeowner then called and said that he had several other companies out to look at his heat pump and they recommended replacing both the indoor coil and the outdoor unit claiming it was the right thing to do. Nobody ever said the outdoor unit was defective.
  We gave the homeowner two options; one was to replace the coil at no charge, or he could pick the coil up and have one of the other companies make the repair and we would warranty the coil. This took place on February 23, 2023, and we never heard back by the deadline we set of February 28, 2023.
  The homeowner then contacted Bryant and complained to them and wanted them to pay for a new system. He reached back out to us on 4-24-2023 and said that Bryant was going to cover the warranty. I told him that I needed documentation to verify this coverage and I received a letter on 5-9-2023 from the Bryant Review Board stating that they were going to do a one-time concession and warranty his indoor coil only and that he was responsible for the labor, refrigerant and misc. charges. Copy of letter included.
  I offered to replace his coil for him but told him he now had to pay for the labor, refrigerant and misc. charges and he got very upset again and stated that we have caused his family great pain and suffering and has written several negative comments online about our company.
  I have told the homeowner that we were no longer interested in working with him.
  In his rebuttal I do not read where he is asking for anything to be done. He just continues to complain about my company.
  Thank you for your time!
  Sincerely,
  ******* ******
   
  5-9-2023
  Dear ******* *********,
  I apologize for the delayed response, your email communication with Hohler was not linked to your original case with the management review board. I have spoken with our District Service Manager (DSM) as well as **** ****** from Hohler Furnace & Sheet Metal.
  The warranty Bryant provided on Model: 315AAV048090AFJA Serial: ********** was a limited 10-year parts warranty from the date the equipment was installed which expired 2/12/2023. As well as a 20-year warranty on the primary heat exchanger, good until 2/12/2033. The manufacturer warranty does not include diagnostic fees, labor, refrigerant, maintenance, etc...
  After speaking with our DSM, we were informed you were provided an out of warranty concession from the distributor for your muffler repair on 3/5/2021 where not only the part was covered, but 4 hours of labor were also covered.
  Our DSM also advised you reached out to Hohler Furnace & Sheet Metal and asked they get started on replacing all of your equipment as the factory was providing you equipment replacements. Please note, this is not true. The offer we the manufacturer offered you was a one-time good will concession to reimburse you for the out of warranty evaporator coil part only. You as the homeowner would be responsible for any service, labor, or refrigerant charges.
  Our offer still stands, If you would like to proceed with our final one-time good will concession to reimburse you for the cost of the evaporator coil part only. Please reach out to Hohler Furnace & Sheet Metal to start the repair process. Once the repair has been completed, please respond back to this email with an itemized paid invoice outlining the cost of the part, service/labor, refrigerant, ect. Once we have received the paid itemized invoice, I would be happy to submit your documents for your one-time good will concession.
  Sincerely,
  **** *****
  Consumer Liaison- Executive Offices
  Carrier Corporation
  Phone: ************
  Email: ****************
  
  
  

  
  

  Customer response

  06/26/2023

  Complaint: ********
  
  I am rejecting Hohler’s response because it is full of half-truths. I have attached my emails between Hohler and Bryant/Carrier management so you can see for yourself.
  The solution we seek is to have a functioning, reliable HVAC unit, which includes the air coil and compressor that was promised to fix the leaks, and repairs of any components that have been affected by the malfunction. We want anything that is malfunctioning/stressed by the malfunction to be fixed, including compressor, clogs, sensors, blowers, etc. The unit went out under warranty and while we had a maintenance agreement with the company and should be 100% covered.   
  
  Based on the advice of other HVAC technicians, Hohler's solution of replacing the air coil would not fix the unit. Based on the diagnostics of five HVAC companies that we have had look at the unit, the unit's compressor is burnt out, there is a floating clog, coolant leak(s), and the furnace blower is also malfunctioning. I have included documentation.  
  We purchased many years of maintenance plans from Hohler because it covered labor for repairs.
  We had a maintenance plan when the unit malfunctioned this year - parts and labor were supposed to be 100% covered, parts under Bryant's warranty and labor covered under Hohler’s maintenance plan that was nearly $400 a year per unit. I have receipts and emails proving this.  
  
  Our unit experienced another major failure of refrigerant components two years ago. The labor was covered under the maintenance plan at that time and I am not aware of any changes to the plan.
  Shortly after finding issues with unit, after I refused to accept an offer for less than what was originally agreed on, Hohler told me that I canceled my maintenance plan, and they didn't want to work with me. have this in writing and phone recording. Funny how they don't mention cancelling my maintenance agreement in their response.
  Hohler came out while the unit was under warranty to perform maintenance. They gave the unit a good report.  We found the unit encased in ice less than two days later and called them back to have another of their technicians look at the unit. The technician found the issue with a leak, low coolant.    
  
  The Bryant heat pump unit failed under warranty. Both Bryant and Hohler refused to honor the warranty - I have this in writing. Bryant stated that they were providing an air coil as a gesture of goodwill, as if they were doing us a favor while, in fact, the failure was covered under the warranty.  
  
  Even though Hohler was aware that we felt the compressor was jeopardized due to the unit having two leaks in the span of two years that required repairs and coolant refills, plus the unit was running hot and freezing over and not shutting down due to the sensors malfunctioning. The compressor was running so hot that the material covering it melted. Yet, they avoided doing a simple diagnostic test called an acid test to determine if the compressor was good or not. Other companies did the acid test and recommended that the compressor be replaced.  
  
  I believe that Hohler avoided diagnosing the compressor and who knows what else - if you don't diagnose it, you don't have to fix it. All it took was a simple acid test; dip a paper tab in the coolant. Based on the color the paper turns, a diagnosis can be made. It is very simple and quick, so why didn't they do it? Several of their competitors knew to do this. I suspect they avoided doing this because the more issues Hohler found, the more they would be required to fix under their maintenance plan.  
  It was not until after Hohler stated that they weren’t working with me that I left a review for their company. I have only written one review, but I posted it to Yelp, Google my Business, Facebook, and BBB. I brought this matter to the public arena not to harass Hohler, but rather to protect the public and make them aware of what my family experienced.   
  
  We only contacted Bryant when Hohler rescinded their offer to replace the coil and compressor. Hohler uses an instance when I told Bryant that another Bryant dealer recommended that the unit should be replaced to say that I demanded a new unit. I never demanded a new unit. A Bryant representative was the one who advised me to find another Bryant dealer. The only other Bryant dealer that was willing to work with us stated that the unit was wonky, that it would be bad business to repair it, and that he would only give me a quote for a new unit. (This conversation took place at my front door, so I have this on video from my doorbell cam) I relayed the info to Bryant and Hohler has interpreted that communication as me demanding a new unit.  
  
  I also brought up the sensors that were malfunctioning and not shutting unit down when it was encased in ice and running hot. Neither Bryant nor Hohler seemed to care about the risk of damage to the unit and, more significantly, the risk of fire due to malfunctioning sensors.  
  
  The warranty on the affected HVAC unit ended 2/12/2023.  We had Hohler come out for maintenance on 2/9/2023. We have video of the unit freezing over before the warranty ended. Hohler sold us a heat pump that sat for 3 years before they installed it. Even though it has been installed for 10 years, it is 13 years old. This detail has hampered the warranty process as well. To suggest that Bryant was making a one-time concession to replace a part that was covered under warranty is disingenuous at best.  
  
  Hohler downplays this point, but this ordeal has truly caused me and my family much suffering. This has been going on for over 4 months - all we want is to have a working HVAC system and for Hohler to honor their word, warranty, and obligations under their maintenance plan.  
  
  My family and I did a lot of research before investing nearly $30,000 in two Bryant heat pump furnace systems that Hohler installed 10 years ago and spending many thousands more for the maintenance plan through Hohler. The marketing stated that Bryant’s products were some of the most dependable in the industry. This is not what the reality has been for my family.  We have had many repairs over the past 10 years. I can’t even recall everything that has been done. More than once, these repairs required trial and error and multiple visits to fix.   
  
  The Bryant heat pump we purchased was one of the first of its type/most advanced in our area. Hohler’s technicians were learning as they went with it. I was told by Hohler’s distributor, who I also contacted over the course of this ordeal, that it is likely this issue goes back to the issue we had two years ago that also involved a leak. I was told that it is rare for these units to leak and having two leaks/requiring two coolant refills in two years is incredibly uncommon.  
  
  We have been advised to leave the malfunctioning heat pump/HVAC unit in place as is, undisturbed in the condition Hohler left it. So, we continue to suffer without a working unit until we have a fair and satisfactory solution.   
  
  Basically, this boils down to Hohler going back on their offer to replace the air coil AND the compressor. They told me they’d do it and then told me they wouldn’t. Again, my family and I simply want a dependable, operable unit and that a company’s words, warranties, and agreements be honored.  
  
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ******* *********  

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