ComplaintsforMilwaukee Motorwerks

• Initial Complaint

  04/29/2024

  Complaint Type:

  Service or Repair Issues

  Status:

  Answered

  More info

  I brought my truck to Milwaukee Motorwerks in early February because my engine light was on. Took my truck to have the codes read by auto zone, they gave me print of the codes. it said was running lean on bank 1 and 2. I showed them the printout. They took code sheet and never gave back to me. I also told them that I had previous work done on truck and showed documentation along with part of what was taken out so they knew. My truck was in and out shop for over a month with no resolution. They put in Pcv diagram and charged me for a part that was recently installed a month prior, and it didn't fix issue. They mentioned that It now needed a high-pressure fuel pump, I told them that the part they were referring to was also added, however only one was installed. I showed them the old part removed and the invoice of the one they did install but truck takes 2 of them. They put 2 new high pressure fuel pumps in. Therefore, I paid the other auto shop for the one they installed and now the 2 that they installed. Total cost charged was. $1769.85. Once i picked up truck and paid bill they truck didn't make it down the block without engine light came on again. Turned around and brought truck back to them for diagnosing again. By this time my truck had been in and out of their shop 6 or 7 times and when I continuously asked for any diagnosis on my truck, they refused to give it to me. I wanted this information to confirm the issues with truck and notes, but ****** never gave me info. Again truck was at shop call day and got a call asking what gas I use. Told them E85. Gas tank can use either E85 or premium. They did partial fill of premium and to run gas out and fill with premium and bring back to read codes. The codes were clear and said issue was fixed. Told them I still want refund for parts already installed. ****** told me i never mentioned it called me liar in front of customer. Difference of $642.34 for those parts. Told I would file complaint w BBB, didn't care!

  Business response

  05/06/2024

  This customer brought the vehicle to us stating the check engine light was on and did in fact state that it was for system lean bank 1 and bank 2.   The customer did mention the vehicle has been to a different shop prior to us, but stated they were unable to resolve the issue, which is why the vehicle came to us.  Commonly the system lean codes are caused by a failed *** valve.  It is a quick easy job to replace and is recommended to be replaced as preventive maintenance since they fail so often.  Upon a physical inspection of the vehicle it was noted the *** valve did NOT look new, replaced, or tampered with recently as it was showing signs of aging.  We recommended replacing this first, the customer approved and we performed the repair.  During our test our drive after the repair the check engine light re-appeared almost immediately for the same codes, system lean bank 1 and bank 2.   We called the customer and explained we wanted to look into the issue more and would not charge her any fee for diagnostic time.  Upon our diagnostic testing we reviewed vehicle live data while test driving the vehicle and found that the fuel trims showed they were excessively being corrected (30%+) by the computer.  Further diagnosis found that fuel pressure on the high pressure side was only showing about 300psi.  This vehicle in specific, a 2016 Range Rover, specifies that fuel pressure at idle must be a minimum of 2500psi.   There are two mechanical fuel pumps that deliver this high pressure system.  A physical inspection of the pumps, which are located on the bottom passenger side of the engine showed that BOTH pumps appeared to be old and/or original to the vehicle.   We recommended replacement of BOTH pumps to the updated brand new part from Range Rover. Since this is a known issue for the pumps to fail Range Rover redesigned the pumps and recommends they are replaced as a pair.  The customer agreed to the repairs and approved of the repairs verbally.  Both pumps were replaced, diagnostic live data showed that fuel pressure at idle exceeded 3000psi, well above specification.  Error codes were cleared and vehicle was test driven.  Error codes did not return immediately as they did prior.  Customer was called and told the vehicle was completed.  A few days later the customer called and said the check engine light reappeared.  We asked her to bring it by so we could check it out.  When it returned the system lean bank 1 and bank 2 codes returned.  Upon discussing this with the customer we learned that she was using E85 fuel and recommended to stop using that and using 93 octane fuel instead as this vehicle recommends 93 octane fuel.   At this time the vehicle had about 1/2 tank of fuel in it, we ran it to the gas station and filled it with **************************************************************************************************** 93 octane to get rid of most of the e85 fuel in the tank that we suspected was causing the issue. We did state the check engine light MIGHT return while e85 fuel is still in the tank, if it does we will clear it free of charge AFTER a full tank of ******************** the vehicle.   About one week later the customer called and demanded we refunded her in full and threatened to report us to the BBB, dispute the credit card charges and so on.   We are not sure if the check engine light is on or if there are further issues as we have not been able to further inspect the vehicle or physically see it since this demand was made.  the customer did not state the check engine light returned either so we believe it did not.  It was obvious to us and likely the customer as well that the fuel pumps were indeed an issue as the fuel pressure was so low and below specification, and now is not.  If a pump was installed prior by another shop we suspect that shop installed a used and/or old fuel pump that was also failed. Or maybe they did not install a pump at all as there was no signs of recent work around the fuel pumps.  Both pumps looked aged the exact same and showed signs of patina from age, which we showed the customer when we physically gave them their TWO old fuel pumps after repairs were complete. We are not responsible for another shop installing used, old or failed parts.  We installed genuine brand new pumps that actually WORK!  i recommend the customer take back the fuel pump the prior shop installed and get a refund from them.  I find this crazy they expect me to refund them because they CLAIM someone else did the job, regardless of the job someone else doing being subpar, or incorrect.

  Customer response

  05/06/2024

  Better Business Bureau:
  
  I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ********, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint.  For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.
  
  [Please type your response here.]
  
  Regards,
  
  ***************************

  Customer response

  05/06/2024

  Better Business Bureau:
  
  I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ********, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint.  For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.
  
  [Please type your response here.]
  
  Regards,
  
  ***************************

  Customer response

  05/08/2024

  Better Business Bureau:
  
  I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ********, and have determined that this does not resolve my complaint.  For your reference, details of the offer I reviewed appear below.
  
  

  The business made a false statement regarding the approval of putting a Crankcase ventilation control valve. Another business in-which I will not name which is legitimate automotive business installed the *** valve June 19th, 2023. Therefore, I have paperwork which supports that a new one was installed. I told ****** this immediately. I would NOT approve to have another one installed and then pay an additional cost to install one. 

  However, installing that valve it had not corrected the issue and light came back on immediately. I didnt return my truck back to them because I was concerned that they were not experienced to work on Range Rovers, so I did not return. 

   

  A referral was given to me that a reputable mechanic can help to diagnose the problem. I had coded read at ********. The codes read that ********* 1 and 2 were lean. His diagnosis read the same and after thorough diagnosing issue he installed High Pressure Fuel pump. Then the part was installed and soon after the engine light came back on. So therefore the new part was installed and he gave me my old part back. My truck would not pass emissions due to this. My renewal of my license was in jeopardy so I called ********************** to see if they were experienced in working on foreign cars and Range Rovers. 

  I again, showed them documentation that idle banks 1 and 2 were running lean. I brought my truck in on February. I told the dealership the work that was already done on the truck and the parts that were installed as well as the codes and returned parts.

  They stated that they wanted their own diagnosis. My truck was in and out of there shop from February to April. They would install parts that didnt correct the codes after driving it. Engine light would come back on. I asked for documentation on what they found and what was installed, however they never gave me any notes as to what was tried and what was done. My truck was worked on by many different mechanics. I asked if I could speak to mechanic and documentation of what tried or done. They refused my request. I should be able to know what the diagnosis was and what was tried. I became suspicious when they would not allow my simple request. 

  They did mention high pressure fuel pump. Tried to get an understanding of what that meant. They told me this was the issue and were assured this would fix the problem. I told ****** that I had a high pressure fuel pump was already installed in my truck and brought the part in and the box stating the date it was installed. I continued to say this along with the part. He took the part to show the mechanic that I had one installed and had the one initially taken out. I DID NOT nor would not approve to have them install another one. That would be ridiculous for me to authorize a new one and pay additional cost for a new one. 

  After they installed it I got the bill and told them I wasnt paying for a part that was already installed. I agreed to approve for one fuel pump and wasnt paying for the *** valve and had the receipt to prove it. The bill was $1769.85. I disputed the bill with ******. Picked up truck drove less than a block and engine light came back on. I called to let them know it came back on again. I was upset that I payed all this money and truck still not fixed. They advised to drive it so that the computer needed to recalibrate. I drove it several miles and the light was still on. Brought it back in for further diagnosis after I paid them all that money for the trucks light still on. My truck was in and out of their shop 6 or 7x all along not being to pass emissions. The long and short of it they asked the gas I was using which was E85. Later realized that was the problem! Not the other parts they kept putting in and charging me. Im asking to resolve this complaint reimbursement of the *** valve which is $51.61 and high pressure fuel pump for the one I never authorized them to put in which is $518.05 +fuel pump tappet ***** total $642.34. This is not a unreasonable request considering I showed them proof with paperwork and actual parts proving install. It was actually the gas E85 that was the problem and thats why such parts didnt work. This is my complaint! 

  Business response

  05/16/2024

  ******, please be advised that in your Land Rover owners manual it specifically states that using E85 fuel can cause serious engine damage!  And although another shop may have installed a new fuel pump, that pump in fact failed as determined by our diagnosis.  E85 uses a very high concentration of ethanol which is well known in the automotive industry to destroy fuel pumps, seals and other engine components!   Please refer to this document released DIRECTLY FROM LAND ROVER regarding the dangers of using E85...

  ***********************************************************************************

  It specifically says "CAUTION:
  Do not use E85 fuels on non-Flexfuel vehicles. Using fuel with 85% ethanol content in non-Flexfuel vehicles can seriously damage the engine and fuel system."

  This is exactly what happened to your vehicle unfortunately.  E85 can destroy even a brand new fuel pump.  I will refund you for the valve at a cost of $51.61 as you are convinced it was not required, but just because YOU used the wrong fuel does not make us on the hook for the expenses occurred from that mistake.  I will also note you disputed your credit card for the entire amount of the repair $1769.85!  How dishonest that you tell the credit card company you want every ***** back for your own mistake, but are telling the BBB you just want to be refunded for one pump that failed because of the wrong fuel being used!  The car needed both pumps when it arrived to us and that's what we installed to correct the fuel pressure issue.  We fixed the vehicle via our diagnosis and advice of which fuel to use to not cause further damage.  Its just an unfortunate ****** learned on using the wrong fuel and the damage it can cause.  I will absolutely not leave my brand new parts installed that FIXED the issue and refund you for that part.
  

   

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