ComplaintsforHacker Automotive Group

• Initial Complaint

  02/10/2022

  Complaint Type:

  Service or Repair Issues

  Status:

  Answered

  More info

  Hacker Automotive: Unfortunately, this business relationship failed miserably and the failure was all on Hacker’s side of the ledger. History *** brought my Volkswagen Jetta to you a second time on December 20, 2021 after your original fix of a fuse replacement failed from early December. At the early December appointment, Hacker was advised that the air sensor had been replaced back in May 2021 and the car was starting/operating haphazardly. At the early December 2021 appointment where Hacker diagnosed a fuse issues, over $250 was paid a fuse replacement. The fuse costs less than $5 and required maybe 15 minutes of work, yet there was a $250+ bill. Three weeks later on December 20 without having done a thorough review at the original appointment, the Jetta had the EXACT same issues with starting again and operating as we initially informed Hacker in early December. After repeatedly calling/emailing after little to no communication for seven weeks, on February 10, we elected to pick up the car after you essentially admitted you either didn’t have the time to repair the car and/or weren’t able to. Hacker’s notes do not address the core issue, which was fixing the car. The Jetta is in the exact same condition on February 10 as it was when brought to Hacker on December 20, 2021. Hacker’s only recommendation, was to purchase a new key, which was NOT the issue at all. By this email, I hereby reject and desire to return the second key, which was NOT the problem and is unnecessary. On top of the second unnecessary key that had no connection to fixing the issues, you charged two hours of labor for no end results and the Jetta issue is not even close to fixed. Moreover, there is no proof it took two hours as the car’s condition is unchanged. Desired resolution At this juncture, I intend to file a complaint with the Better Business Bureau and the Ohio Attorney General Consumer Affairs division in addition to disputing the charge on my AMEX card.

  Business response

  02/15/2022

  In response to Mr. **** ******** complaint(s) on 2/10/22 for the vehicle he owns and lets his son Malachi drive.
  
  
  I can appreciate that:
  
  - Car maintenance can be frustrating; especially when your vehicle has multiple levels of issues and diagnostic time is needed to address these layers in step-by-step format which can add time and cost      to get to the end resolution(s). 
  - A customer's car is always preferred to be looked at as fast as possible and most would prefer not to wait in a production line if they had a choice.  
  - Follow up looks different to different people.  
  

  So those things being said and to address the complaint categories noted in Mr. ******** document to you, I do believe we have:
  
  
  TIMING: Been very up front with Mr. ******. The car was towed in days before holiday closures which we made him aware of was through 1/4/22 and that active production would be carrying over into at least the second week of January.  Additionally, since there were some delays that were outside of our control (parts delays, shipping and force majeures); we gave Mr. ****** multiple opportunities to take his car elsewhere before any billable time/parts were accrued (12/21/21 through ****** call to ****; 1/7/22 when **** came into the shop and talked with *****; 1/11/22's email from *****)
  
  
  FIRST SERVICE VISIT 12/7/21: Fixed the initial issue* because the car would not start at all when inspected at the vehicle's first-ever time at our facility and for a fair price which was pleasing to the customer at that time for diagnostic testing to determine it was in fact the fuse failing, the service to replace the fuse and then reinitializing the vehicle, i.e. programming.
  

  - The repair was proven effective by the fact that the customer drove the vehicle off the lot 
  - Continued to drive it for a few weeks thereafter 
  - We could start the car after it was towed in for the second time on 12/20/21.  
  - If the ignition fuse had blown again, the car would not be able to start for anyone.
  - Invoice ***** is attached
  

  *Indicates that we informed the customer that the fuse panel is in the driver's footwell area which was being exposed to significant moisture in the vehicle and should the moisture not be addressed, could cause more issues with the fuses as we could see corrosion build up already.  We cannot be held accountable for future issues in this panel as moisture exposure continued past the 12/7/21 visit and for which the customer declined our service to a define the leak source (leak test through water testing and inspection) and to dry out the vehicle (remove seats, remove carpet...) at that time.
  
  
  DIFFERENT PROBLEM AT SECOND SERVICE VISIT 12/20/21: Proven that there was a different issue going on as we were able to start the vehicle on the first attempt 
  

  - After repeated attempts on different days to identify what our customer experienced, we were able to experience a start/stop.  
  - The car started but then quickly stalled.  
  - I asked for clarity and we received confirmation that this is in fact what Malachi had experienced when he said "no start" at this visit, through email.  
  - We further investigated the starting system 
  - We explained to the customer that through diagnostic testing, we could see that the car was not recognizing the key (there is a transponder in the fob which is programmed to the vehicle in addition to    the key shaft being cut to match this vehicle's key cylinder and locks)
  - We asked them to drop off their second key.  
  - Mr. ****** confirmed they did not have a spare key 
  - We proposed the customer get a second key as it is always a good idea to have a spare key because if a transponder fails on your only key, you will not be able to start your car until you get another -      so a back-up is great to have, regardless
  - Customer approved
  - Once the key arrived and we could work to get it back into production, programming on the vehicle to synchronize the new key failed with multiple attempts.  
  - This necessitated additional time of diagnostics to determine what was preventing a successful program.  
  - Additional controlled tests confirmed the data bus was not communicating with any other modules in the car (essentially the needed computer communication chain within the vehicle was not working -    data bus being a central computer system that must communicate out to and with the ancillary modules within the vehicle).  
  - This is when we stopped and realized the water issues of this vehicle could be having a much greater impact on the vehicle then just the fuse panel corrosion and is probably what caused the ignition        fuse to blow in the first place (issue at original visit).  
  - We shared this with the customer and strongly recommended that he not invest in any more diagnostic work on the vehicle until the car was completely dried out as we firmly believe the moisture and      water issues are impacting the computer/module/communications which are causing his symptoms.
  - Once the leak source is addressed and the car is dried out, then it should yield a better place to gauge performance and determine on-goingly, if any, permanent damage would need to be addressed        (this is like a flood car situation). 
  - We capped the labor charge for all of the start attempts, initial inspection/diagnostic test which lead to the second key request and repeated attempts to program the key to the allotted time given in        the original estimate for the key and out of good will, we covered the additional diagnostic time which lead to the identification of the data bus issue and ultimate recommendation to stop further              diagnostic testing until the vehicle's leak was corrected and the vehicle dried out thoroughly.
  - Additionally, to assess the moisture's impact further, as the morning of 2/10/22 was warm and sunny, our technicians placed the car on our lot in the sun and left all doors open to help dry out some of      the superficial moisture which wasn't dissipating even while in the shop. 
  - This did help the car to resume starting and stay running such that we could position it on the lot for customer pick up and hopefully give the customer some time to drive it home where we recommend    fully drying it out with all seats removed along with all carpet as previously discussed and for which the customer has declined our service to do for the second time.
  - Invoice ***** is attached

  WATER LEAK: At both visits Mr. ****** was asking where we thought the water entry point was. 
  

  - I informed him that there are many places we have seen water enter a vehicle from window seals to damaged plastic covers to sunroofs to other 
  - We also discussed that until we actually conducted a water bath test on his vehicle, we could not confirm for sure where his water source was coming from into the cabin.  
  - He declined this test at the first visit but agreed to its service while the car was here for its second visit because he agreed that they needed to know where the entry point into the cabin was so they        knew what to do to address it.  
  - When testing the vehicle, we noted that in this case, it is in fact coming from the sunroof and you can see the details on the attached receipt.  
  - Mr. ****** declined further service from us as he said he and his son would address it along with drying it out.
  - He was charged for this approved service.
  

  CORE ISSUE: Determined that the water is causing many malfunctions within his vehicle and until the water is stopped from entering into the vehicle and the vehicle is completely dried out, there very likely will continue to be these on-going issues. 
  
  - The fuse and reinitializing addressed round one
  - Finding computer communication issues impeding the key's programming, at the second visit, further confirms the interference the moisture is causing as it is compromising the electronics within the        vehicle.  
  - Moisture/water exposure can permanently damage components if not addressed quickly.  
  - The next step recommendation has been outlined in writing and reiterated verbally - stop the leak, dry out the car.  
  - As the customer did not want to pay for our services to address the sunroof nor dry out the vehicle, that is outside of our control.
  

  KEY: Asked the customer for his second key to use in the diagnostic process to confirm/eliminate the key from being the issue of the immobilizer - key non-recognition. 
  
  - Since the customer stated they only had one key, we did recommend getting a second both for the sake of this diagnostic process and the benefit of always having a second key on hand.  
  - The customer agreed that it's a good idea to have a second key on hand and authorized its purchase.  
  - I did review multiple times that we could not confirm that the key would in fact solve this issue but would be the next step to help diagnose what is going on due to non-recognition
  - Mr. ****** understood as we all agreed to the benefit of two keys, if nothing more.  
  - Additionally, I informed Mr. ****** that keys are not returnable as they are unique to that VIN.  
  - Mr. ****** said he understood.  
  - We charged the customer for the key
  
  
  COMMUNICATION: Been very communicative.  We had several phone calls, nearly a dozen emails and two in person discussions in addition to February 10th when Mr. ****** coordinated picking up his vehicle.  I understand that our customer had calls into our shop when we were closed and some which didn't get replied to daily at times as we informed Mr. ****** that we are understaffed and were also dealing with my unplanned departures from the shop as we were dealing with a life and death family situation over the holidays and early into the new year.  I specifically made him aware that this took me away from the phones and would not be able to answer every call but that I would get in touch with him as we had data, which I did. And while I can appreciate Mr. ****** may not see it as such, we had given his vehicle priority attention as we have cars that were here ahead of his that are still awaiting completion due to delays that were out of our control as well.  Our email chain is attached.
  
  
  As for the bill, we didn't design Mr. ******'s car nor create the condition it is in.  We have been more than fair with the capped charges as we cannot do diagnostic work and testing work for free and explained the key was non-returnable. 
  
  
  We wish Mr. ****** the best of luck determining what the best next steps are for he, his son and for the future of their vehicle and strongly recommend, if keeping the car, that the water source be addressed and the car dried out before investing anything further to help them control variables and limit parts being further compromised as this is needed to neutralize the situation.
  

  Due to space, we could only attach one photo here which is of the footwell showing the damp conditions and mold growth though we have others.
  
  Best Wishes,

  Tammy H

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