ComplaintsforClifton Chase Homeowners Association, Inc.

• Initial Complaint

  02/13/2023

  Complaint Type:

  Customer Service Issues

  Status:

  Answered

  More info

  This is regarding me wanting to pay my HOA fees but couldn't because of no further communication from the guy who "runs" the HOA. I have been trying to get a response from the guy who lives at the address associated with Clifton Chase HOA since June 23rd, 2022, and have not heard back since. I have sent numerous e-mails and letters pointing out that I cannot pay if I'm not provided the information I'm asking for. In both e-mails and letters, I have mentioned that 1) Any attempt to put a lien on my house would not be valid since he refuses to communicate with me, and 2) I should not have to pay any arbitrary late fees since he is the one purposely preventing me from paying by not giving me any information. After receiving the "3rd and Final Notice", I became incredibly pissed off over all of this and how he has the audacity to pull this stunt, even though he is the one at fault and ignorantly (or purposely) believes he can do whatever he wants with having a vendetta against me. He said he "volunteered" to do it, well, he should've realized what he was getting himself into beforehand, and shouldn't just run away and hide from a problem that he started. I WANT to discuss about, and pay, my HOA fees (those extra charges are asinine), but I can't. I can't because the guy at the HOA refuses to get ahold of me and discuss it in a professional, mature manner. I strongly believe he is doing unfair treatment against me. If I do not hear from him soon, I will have no choice but to start considering legal advice.

  Business response

  02/23/2023

  Complaint ID 19396734
  
  ***** ***** <j**************>
  Feb 21, 2023, 5:05 PM (2 days ago)
  to disputeresolution
  
  
  
  I have reviewed the complaint made regarding the Clifton Chase HOA. This property owner is over $1175.00 in debt to the HOA for his dues. He was in the arrears with the prior administrator of the HOA.  We have spoken to the Homeowner previously & provided several acceptable ways to pay his Dues.  He may pay by check, money order, cashier’s check or cash (he would be provided with a receipt). The HOA does not have a PayPal, Venmo or Zelle account. We take the security of our HOA accounts very seriously & will not open any type for on-line account that could jeropardize the funds in the HOA accounts.  We have not been asked by any other Homeowner to create this type of on-line forms of payments. We believe we have provided several acceptable options.  Unfortunately, we have not been able to come to a satisfactory solution for this Homeowner.  
  
  Sent from AT&T Yahoo Mail for iPad
  

  Customer response

  02/23/2023

  [If you do not say why you are rejecting the company's response, BBB must close your complaint.] 
  
  Complaint: 19396734
  
  I am rejecting this response because: 

  The respondent, "***** *****", is completely wrong when they say, "We have spoken to the Homeowner previously & provided several acceptable ways to pay his Dues. He may pay by check, money order, cashier’s check or cash (he would be provided with a receipt). Unfortunately, we have not been able to come to a satisfactory solution for this Homeowner." This is an absolute lie. I do not understand the reasoning behind their delusional, willful ignorance; Since June of 2022, there has been NO further communication from ******* *****, much less a "***** *****". I have sent multiple e-mails and snail mail with no response from *******. I have provided multiple documents as proof of my attempts to reach ******* *****, whose name is the only name that appears on the records of the current agent for the HOA. There is no ***** ***** listed for it, and that name has never once showed up on any documentation I received from the HOA. So, as far as I'm concerned, "***** *****" could be another made-up story. No communication from the HOA, when I repeatedly asked for information since June 2022, also means that no mentioning about how to pay was provided. I have received no e-mail responses since; I also check my Spam box constantly and no e-mails from him were ever received by me. I have three different e-mail accounts, and all three have not received a response.

  Them claiming that no one else asked for online paying ability is also a bold-face lie, as I've spoken with several homeowners and they have mentioned how convenient it would be if payment could be done online. Two homeowners also mentioned to me how they also couldn't get ahold of ******* ***** (again, no one mentioned a ***** *****) when they needed something, so it sounds to me like this is another made-up story. Also, they said it's better when a business handles an HOA because having a single person who has a very flippant attitude towards others running it is a disaster waiting to happen. The very last response I got from ******* ***** via e-mail was just a sniffy reply in a defensive manner before blocking my e-mails, because they can't handle constructive criticism in a professional manner.

  My "dues" were in arrears because the previous HOA agents never bothered to send out any sort of bill when they were busy dissolving from handling the HOA. If they did, I would've paid, as I always kept up with my bills until they went away. Then, ******* ***** comes into play and magically I get a generalized bill that didn't break down what the fees were. When is this ******* ***** going to get it into his head that he is the one at fault, he is the one handling this poorly, and he is the one who needs to get his head out of the sand?

  I WANT to pay my dues, but the guy is doing what he can to avoid me, and turning around and making lies about reaching out to me. He lives not four streets away from me, and I have personally driven over to his residence to hand deliver letters into his mailbox requesting information on the matter (which I am lawfully allowed to). I have provided my contact information several times and never heard back. He can even come on by and knock on my door to speak to me, if he had the backbone to do it, anyway.

  
  
  Regards,
  
  *** *******

  Business response

  03/18/2023

  My name is ******* *****, I am on the Board of the Clifton Chase Homeowners Association along with ******* *********.  A little background on our Homeowners Association, the Clifton Chase Homeowners Association was started in 1998 when this community was first built. I moved into this area in 2014. When I moved to the area Onyx Realty was managing the Clifton Chase Homeowners Association.  The Board consisted of 3 Homeowners at that time who managed and assisted the Onyx Realty.  I do not have exact dates at this time but will be happy to research if necessary. Onyx Realty services were terminated by the Homeowners for a request to raise dues and not managing our community. The 3 Board Members than researched and hired Elite Managment company to manage the Clifton Chase Homeowners Association. Unfortunately, this company misappropriated the Clifton Chase Homeowners Association's funds, and our community was in the red. At which time it was decided to terminate their services. The former Board Members decided they no longer wished to be on the Board.  ******* ********* and I volunteered to be on the Board.  A part of our first job was to secure a new Homeowners Association Management company. After contacting many companies no one was interested in fronting their services without payment. The Clifton Chase Homeowner's Association did not have any funds to hire a new management company. It was suggested we self-manage until a time where we had Funds.  

  Our first thought was to secure funds, get the invoices out to have the dues paid so we can hire a new Homeowners Association Management Company.  Then we realized that we did not have a Bank account to deposit the Funds. This was at the beginning of the pandemic. We were not able to get an appointment at any bank to set-up an account at any Financial Institution. We could not send a request for Dues when we had no account to deposit. 

  Spring was upon us we had no Funds and Landscaping needed to be done. I felt responsible for our community and how it would be perceived if we had common areas that were overgrown. My wife (***** *****) and I hired a Landscaper and paid for the services ourselves for the season. This was not my responsibility, but I live here, this is my neighborhood.  We were eventually able to open an account and send invoices to the Clifton Chase Homeowners. Was it the most professional looking I can admit no they weren't but we our community needed Funds. Property taxes for the common areas was coming due and a new year of Landscaping. This is just a small update on how we got to where we are with the Clifton Chase Homeowners Association. But I digress, to answer the complaints and concerns of Mr. *******.

  1) I am a retired senior whose 40-year career was in Digital Management and serving as the Vice President of my Local. ******* ********* works in the grocery industry. Neither of these professions should suggest that we have worked in Homeowners Association Management. I believe that being retired allows me some discretion and latitude of how I speak and write. I find it morally reprehensible that anyone would allude to the educational background of anyone. Some of the best people I know do not have a college education or English is a second language. They are the kindest, intelligent and astute people I have the pleasure of knowing professionally and personally.

  2) Although I am a retired senior citizen neither ******* nor I are from the stone age. We send written letter to all of the households informing them of meetings or concerns. Some of our members do use Facebook and the Nextdoor applications to communicate. It has never been suggested that someone from our community must use the applications, this is just another means to inform our members of upcoming events. Mr. ******* is always welcome to volunteer to be on the Board and bring his grammatical expertise to write any of future invoices, directives or memorandums. 

  3) Our community is not a Dictatorship it is a Democracy. The previous Homeowner Association Management companies did indeed offer online payments at a cost to the Associations. All costs for portal payments were billed back to us. 

      As a Board Member I did my due diligence and looked into the cost for an Online Portal system. As an example of one company I reviewed, the cost is $20 per month for the portal system, 2.99% cost per transaction and 0.10 per dollar to process an online portal payment. If Mr. ******* would like to attend the next Homeowner's Association meeting to put it to a vote with the other Homeowners, we would be happy to put it to a vote. Of course, only Homeowners in good standing can vote for any changes that would be the financial responsibility of the community. 

  4) I have a fiduciary duty to our community. I have again completed my due diligence and researched payment applications such as Venmo, Zelle and Paypal. Mr. ******* has suggested that the applications are 100% safe. My opinion differs based on articles from Forbes, the New York Times and Los Angeles Times just to name a few who have published articles on these applications and have stated that in the last year there has been a 900% increase in scams and fraud associated with these applications. If Mr. ******* would like to bring to the next meeting and bring information that suggests that we are wrong, we would be happy to present it to the Clifton Chase Homeowners for a vote. I cannot make the decision for the community. I am currently the person who does have the fiduciary responsibility for the Funds of the Clifton Chase Homeowners Association. Mr. ******* is more than welcome to come to the next meeting and volunteer to be on the Board to help with these decisions. So, for now we do not have the payment options. I do take my responsibilities seriously. 

  5) Mr. ******* was correct in our previous communication my final sentence may have been misleading, I was referring to the previous Managements companies that did offer online payment portals to pay at a cost to our community. 

  6) In a previous communication with Mr. ******* he suggested we meet man to man. I am again a retired senior citizen; I perceived this comment as a threat. If Mr. ******* would like to meet neighbor to neighbor, I am more than willing to meet with him to discuss his complaints and concerns. 

  7) We have offered several ways for him to pay his Homeowner Association Dues, the question now becomes why Mr. ******* has not paid his dues?  To reiterate this community since the beginning has had a Homeowners Association and as he alluded to in his complaint, he has talked to other neighbors who have assured him that we have a Homeowners Association. I have a quote that I live by from my previous professional life "If you cannot be part of the solution at least don't be part of the problem".

  We would love for Mr. ******* to attend the next meeting bring his ideas, requests for changes, anything that will make our community a better place to live for the hardworking families that live here. I believe I have addressed his complaints and concerns to the best of my ability. 

   

   

  Customer response

  03/20/2023

  [If you do not say why you are rejecting the company's response, BBB must close your complaint.] 
  
  Complaint: 19396734
  
  I am rejecting this response because:

  I will simply address just several of the comments provided by Mr. ******* *****:
  

  1. I do not care how Mr. ***** wants to perceive and dress up excuses for why he feels writing in a manner that can throw someone off-guard and make them cautious; if you want to be taken seriously, then write seriously. If someone points out that the writing comes across sketchy and is giving concern, perhaps take it as constructive criticism and not as a personal attack. English isn't my first language and, yet, I am able to speak, spell, and write it in a coherent and intelligible manner so that I can get my point across effectively.

  2. Mr. ***** continues to constantly overlook what I've said many times over: the bills for the dues did NOT have instructions on how to provide payment. They simply said, "You owe this much." and that was it. There were no additional pieces of information that say, "Mail check, money order to this address, or you can stop by personally and provide cash, check, or money order." So, again I ask, "How can one pay when NO INSTRUCTIONS WERE PROVIDED?" How many times do I have to repeat that until it registers? Mr. ***** seems to be wanting to skirt around this fact. If you don't provide instructions on how to pay, how do you expect to get paid? I've said it many times, "I WANT to pay, but I CAN'T pay if you do NOT provide me instructions on HOW to pay."

  3. If Mr. ***** wanted to view my comment of "man to man" as a threat (seriously, who says, "neighbor-to-neighbor"?), that is not my problem. How he wants to perceive text online is beyond my control. He should also realize that his own actions is what started this problem in the first place. Two e-mail addresses were provided on the very first letter that talked about the changes: Mr. *****'s and Ms.*******'s. I never received a response back from either e-mail address when I first got the letter and attempted to contact them with my Gmail account. Later on, Mr. ***** responded back after I sent him another e-mail from my Hotmail account. Only after I had to repeat all that I said in my Gmail message did he obviously block me. So, how can one get ahold of the HOA when it was his and *******'s e-mail address and neither choose to respond? Does he not see how this continues to come across as not taking things seriously?

  4. If Mr. ***** wants to become passive-aggressive and feel threatened because "I am educated", again, that is not my problem and out of my control. Perhaps it's a bit of insecurity that's playing on their part, who knows?

  All of this would not have happened if Mr. ***** had bothered to maintain communication with me. I have provided proof showing I've tried to reach out with no response from Mr. *****. Simply put, if it were not for his actions in how he handled this, we wouldn't be in this mess. This is a result of Mr. *****'s actions, not mine. If he does not like how someone reacts to it, then stop and think that maybe he's in the wrong. A person will only get pissed at someone else if that someone else did something quite wrong, which is what Mr. ***** has done.

  I will handle this amicably and peacefully, but I can only do that if Mr. ***** chooses to take this seriously and contact me. I'm pretty sure he has my e-mail address. I have the money. I want to pay. But, I can only pay if he communicates with me. I'm not going to bite someone's head off, but this constant song-and-dance of them dragging their heels will cause anyone to become frustrated. Make things right and things will go right.

  How much simpler can that be said?

  
  Regards,
  
  *** *******

*Some consumers may elect to not publish the details of their complaints, some complaints may not meet BBB's standards for publication, or BBB may display a portion of complaints when a high volume is received for a particular business. ↩