ComplaintsforPromotionalProductsOnline.com

• Initial Complaint

  06/15/2024

  Complaint Type:

  Service or Repair Issues

  Status:

  Resolved

  More info

  I purchased 1,000 bottle openers in good faith. The product I received was not as described. I have tried to talk with the staff, even the owner, yet I am getting a runaround.

  

  Business response

  06/19/2024

  Dear Mr *****,
  
  We genuinely value your feedback and aim to ensure every customer is satisfied with their purchase.
  
  We understand your disappointment with the size and engraving of the bottle openers you ordered. Our records show that the proof sent to you was at 100% size, and noted on the proof itself, with the suggestion to print it to see it at 100% to see physical actual size, and was noted on the website. This was done to accurately represent the item’s dimensions and engraving.
  
  Regarding the engraving, we used the exact artwork you provided and followed the approved proof meticulously. It appears that the readability of your logo was impacted by the design and size chosen. We noticed that the new order you placed with another company was a larger item and an inverted logo, which indeed enhanced the logo’s readability. This suggests that the design adjustments made were beneficial and not a result of any error on our part.
  
  Despite multiple attempts to reach you initially via phone to discuss and resolve your concerns, we regret that we were unable to connect, you'll note we did leave voicemails and requested a callback. We do apologize for the miscommunication regarding the last attempt to connect, due to a time zone miscalculation made on our part. I understand that you were waiting for the call, as I was also looking forward to the call for the same hour, hoping to resolve this — and I regretted myself when I realized that I had made the time zone / calculation error especially as service in the area I was in is not always reliable to start with.
  
  While we believe we fulfilled the order as per the approved specifications, we understand your dissatisfaction. As a gesture of goodwill and to resolve this matter, we would like to offer you a partial refund. This reflects our commitment to your satisfaction while also considering the customization and approval process that was followed.
  
  Please contact me / us at your earliest convenience to discuss the partial refund amount and finalize the resolution.
  
  Thank you for your understanding and for giving us the opportunity to address your concerns.
  
  Sincerely,
  
  ***** *******
  President
  PromotionalProductsOnline.com
  T ###-###-#### (can text as well)
  ***********

  Customer response

  06/23/2024

  [If you do not say why you are rejecting the company's response, BBB must close your complaint.] 
  
  Complaint: ********
  
  I am rejecting this response because: 

  I have attached five items:

  1) Actual photos of my bottle openers.  One can easily see that they are not of good quality.

  2) The artwork that was sent to me.  The pictures do NOT look like the finished product.

  3) Emails with replies by staff; Even saying that I should get painted artwork in the future (this is counter to everything they and others say, that etched is higher quality, and lasts longer, etc.  Seriously, they are saying I should not have ordered from them?!)

  4) website photos of their bottle openers.  These photos do not show any of the imperfections that their actual product has.

  5) "Foundational Details" taken directly from their website.  Please see the highlighted references that turned out to be not true.

  This company does not seem to get it with customer service.  They do not have any reviews yet for the product I purchased.  Why is that?  They say their warranty covers craftmanship, now they are arguing that.  The artwork I signed off on does not look like the actual artwork on my product.  The proofs did not accurately depict the final product, and they never mentioned until afterwards that the final product would be flawed.  This is FALSE ADVERTISING.

  
  Regards,
  
  *** *****

  

  Business response

  06/24/2024

  Dear Mr. *****,
  
  Thank you for your detailed response and for providing additional information regarding your order. We take all feedback seriously and strive to address any concerns thoroughly. Below, we respond to each of your points:
  
  1. Photos of the Bottle Openers: 
  
  We have reviewed the photos you provided, which were taken at an extremely close range, approximately 1 to 2 inches away. For clarity, we have included images showing the item held in a hand, as would be used, as your images do not give any indication of scale and magnification. At your photo’s magnification, the laser engraving process's inherent characteristics / signature is visible. The laser creates minute spots of contact to vaporize the anodized surface, revealing the silver aluminum beneath it. This process can result in slight visual imperfections when viewed at such a close distance — distances which are not possible to the naked eye, or normal usage conditions. Additionally the lowest line of text — approximately 2 to 3-point size — is readable but shows some engraving effects due to its very small size. These details are exaggerated by the macro photography. Insofar as product quality, we assure you that the items are crafted to maintain their quality and durability during typical use. 
  
  2. Artwork Sent and Finished Product Comparison: 
  
  The digital proof you received is intended to show the size, placement, and correctness of the artwork for approval, as is standard best-practice in the industry. It is important to print the proof at 100% in order to see the actual size, as was specifically noted in the Free Preview emailed communication. Note that blowing up a section of a digital proof on a screen can give a misleading impression of the level of detail, which does not translate directly to the smaller engraved area on the actual item, nor does it represent normal viewing conditions. The proof was created to be an accurate representation of the final product’s customization when viewed at 100%, and our engraving process followed the approved proof exactly. The differences you are observing are likely due to enlarging the digital proof beyond its intended size, rather than any discrepancy in the engraving process itself, and the fact that a digital layout proof cannot be exactly the same as a product. Additionally, it seems the proof may not have been printed out at 100% scale as noted to do. If it had been, the smallness of the text and the overall size of the item would have been apparent, potentially avoiding any future surprise about the final product dimensions.
  
  3. Emails and Staff Recommendations: 
  
  Our customer service representative suggested printed artwork as an alternative based on your feedback about the engraving visibility and look. Our customer service representative's suggestion regarding screen printed artwork was intended to provide an option, based on your feedback about the engraving characteristics. The suggestion that you might consider a printed product was made in good faith to offer you a potential idea, not to imply that screen printing is superior to laser engraving (it is not) or that you should not have ordered from us. Laser engraving is a highly regarded method for its durability and quality, and this is why we exclusively offer this technique for our products. It is unfortunate that this suggestion was misinterpreted. The representative’s recommendation was purely aimed at addressing your specific concern about the look of the engraving. The proof provided was a digital representation to illustrate placement, size, and correctness. The final product, being a physical item, will naturally differ slightly from the digital proof, particularly in terms of texture and appearance due to the nature of laser engraving. However, we followed the approved proof exactly, and the product was produced as described.
  
  1. Website Photos vs. Actual Product: 
  
  The photos on our website are intended to represent our products accurately, and, we take all our own imagery, with that always in mind. The example on our website does not misrepresent the product — but rather reflects these inherent challenges. For example, the very example online of the blue item you ordered, laid out similarly to your design, does show that very small text can be harder to read. In fact, it's represented as harder to read online, than on your actual items. Very small text, like on the bottom of your openers, is more challenging to read, and this is consistent with your experience. This is due to the physical limitations of engraving / reproducing small details, and varying eyesight capabilities, and would be the same if screen printed or otherwise.
  
  2. "Foundational Details" from Our Website:
  
   We stand by the foundational details provided on our website:
      * Working closely with product design: We fine-tune all aspects of our products to ensure high quality.
      * State-of-the-art equipment: We continuously invest in the latest technology to maintain superior engraving standards.
      * Superior quality control: All engraving is performed in-house to ensure quality control.
      * Free preview service: Our free proofing process is designed to identify potential issues before production. It is crucial that customers print proofs at 100% to understand the actual size and placement as is noted on the proof itself.
  
  It appears that the primary issue stemmed from the specified size of the item on the website not being taken into consideration when ordering, and then the proof not being printed out at the recommended 100% scale, which would have provided a clear indication of the item's size and the legibility of small text. This is supported by the initial email to us expressing surprise regarding the product size. 
  
  Subsequently, we offered a 20% discount as a gesture of goodwill. By the time we heard back from you and could discuss further, you had already ordered larger items elsewhere and modified your logo for better readability / visibility.
  
  We are committed to resolving this amicably. We are still willing to offer a partial refund as a gesture of goodwill. Please contact us to discuss this further so we can find a fair resolution for both parties.
  
  Warm regards,
  
  ***** *******

  Customer response

  07/01/2024

  [If you do not say why you are rejecting the company's response, BBB must close your complaint.] 
  
  Complaint: 21856733
  
  I am rejecting this response because: 

  The owner is far better at photography than I am, and his picture of the openers is misleading.  If you zoom in on his hand-held openers, you will see more of the imperfections and streaks in the silver area.  Many factors can play a role in his photography: lighting, distance, angle, etc.  My picture was taken with my old I-phone, and certainly doesnt accentuate the imperfections that I could show with a better camera.  And I assure you, in person, these imperfections are far greater than he is acknowledging.
  
  I was surprised at how small these openers are (which by the way the size was not properly stated in the product description).  But given that, it therefore has a smaller surface area than a larger opener would have.  And by his own logic, a larger surface area would show the imperfections of his product even more.  He makes an argument that larger openers would be better quality, which contradicts himself and his product.
  
  He also acknowledges that his laser engraving process:
   vaporizing of the anodized surface, and revealing the silver aluminum beneath it.
  This was never disclosed on his website or on the artwork.
  
  But a larger point of contention is the following statement, that the above process will lead to:
  slight visual imperfections when viewed at such a close distance- distances which are not possible to the naked eye, or normal usage conditions.
  That is blatantly FALSE.  As I am writing this, I can pick them up and look at them from the distance they are normally viewed at, and to be able to read the text on them, and see the many imperfections as I have noted.  Again, I am impressed with the sellers photographic talents to mask such imperfections, but his narrative is not accurate or based on reality.
  
  RE: His website Foundational Details, all he did was add those to his reply back to me.  On the Foundational Details that I sent to him I highlighted the areas of quality and oversight that I think are lacking, resulting in the quality issues we are talking about.
  
  Bottom line: He acknowledges that the product does not match the artwork.
  
  

  Regards,
  

  
  *****************

  

  Business response

  07/03/2024

  Dear **************
  
  Thank you for your response. We have reviewed your comments thoroughly and would like to address each point you raised:
  
  Photography and Product Imperfections:
  We assure you that the photos we provided were taken with an iPhone as well, without any added lighting or any effects, they were not manipulated in any way. The photos are straight out of the camera / phone and show the items as they are. The laser engraving process, uses minute spots of light contact to vaporize the anodized surface, revealing the silver aluminum beneath it. This is a standard process, and, it is in fact detailed on our website: High-Quality Permanent Laser Engraving - ***************************************************************************
  
  Product Size and Description:
  The dimensions of the bottle openers actually are clearly stated on the product page on our website. It is also important to print the digital proof at 100% to see the actual size and placement, as noted in the instructions. If this had been done, the smallness of the text and the overall size of the item would have been apparent, likely avoiding any surprises about the final product dimensions and readability. Your assertion that larger openers would show more imperfections is incorrect. A larger engraving area allows for a higher laser spot count, resulting in a crisper overall reproduction of artwork and text.
  
  Laser Engraving Process:
  The laser engraving process, which involves vaporizing the anodized surface to reveal the silver aluminum beneath, is a standard method and is thoroughly detailed on our website. This process is the same for all metal laser engravings, including the items you ordered from another company, with which you are satisfied.
  
  Viewing Distance and Imperfections:
  While slight visual imperfections can be noted under extreme close-up views, these are not noticeable under normal viewing conditions. The photos we provided accurately represent the items, and there was no intention to mask any imperfections. The text and layout were reproduced as per your approved proof, and the readability is consistent with what was shown in the proof.
  
  Foundational Details:
  Our foundational details, as stated on our website, are accurate and reflect our commitment to quality, and we did add some text for your benefit that you may not have noticed, and will put them here again:
  
  Working closely with product design: We fine-tune all aspects of our products to ensure high quality.
  State-of-the-art equipment: We continuously invest in the latest technology to maintain superior engraving standards.
  Superior quality control: All customization is performed in-house to ensure meticulous quality control.
  Free preview service: Our proofing process is designed to identify potential issues before production. It is crucial that customers print proofs at 100% to understand the actual size and placement.
  
  Product Match to Artwork:
  We have never acknowledged that the product does not match the artwork. The items were produced  as per the approved proof, and using the artwork as we were directed. The dissatisfaction appears to stem from not considering the size listed online, and not printing the proof at 100%. The fact that you are satisfied with a larger product and an inverted logo from another provider indicates that the issue was with the initial product chosen and design choice not our product or production process.
  
  *************, we understand mistakes can happen. We remain willing to offer a discount, and will raise it to 50%, as a gesture of goodwill, even though we followed your direction, and produced items according to your product choice, and the approved artwork. Custom items cannot be returned and restocked; therefore, providing a full refund would not be ethical or in line with our terms and conditions: ************************************************ .
  
  If you would like, you may respond to this communication and we will credit your card 50%. Or call us to discuss, which is what was preferred all along and it was unfortunate we didn't connect earlier as I stated and was my personal error while traveling as speaking "in person" often is much more pleasant and usually beneficial to all. You may reach me directly at ************, you may text me at that number as well.
  
  I would look forward to speaking with you, and we appreciate your patience, and hope to regain your trust.

  Customer response

  07/06/2024

  [A default letter is provided here which indicates your acceptance of the business's response.  If you wish, you may update it before sending it.]
  
  Better Business Bureau:
  
  I accept the business's response to resolve this complaint.
  
  *****************

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