ComplaintsforModern Woodmen of America

• Initial Complaint

  03/25/2024

  Complaint Type:

  Sales and Advertising Issues

  Status:

  Answered

  More info

  On December 19, 2023 I contacted Modern Woodmen of America (MWA) via email to request a *************** transfer to Vanguard. Based on guidance provided by ******************************************************************* an official documented and signed transfer form was provided via email to on February 6, 2024. A follow-up email was sent to ************************************************************************* and ******************************************************************* on March 7, 2024. As of March 24, 2024 I have received no responses to either the FEB or Mar 2024 emails. There is no evidence that MWA has taken any action on my requests. I prefer to communicate with a demonstrative trail rather than telephone comms. Today Mar 24, 2004, I also initiated a request to Vanguard to attempt to pull the *************** from MWA. In 2023 I had a traditional *** transferred from MWA to Vanguard. At that time, a Vanguard representative indicated that MWA might require transfers to be made on MWA forms. MWA does provide forms for direct download from their website but not for transferring assets out. I contacted my local MWA representative in mid 2023 who advised that no MWA forms were needed and that Vanguard Transfer forms were all that were needed. MWA home office refused to transfer the assets on Vanguard paper and provided the previously hidden transfer form. MWA's miscommunications delayed my 2023 Traditional *** transfer by several weeks. That experience led me to contact MWA directly in Dec 2023 for the *************** transfer. My desired resolution is the completion of the transfer request and forfeiture of any withdrawal penalties.

  

  Business response

  03/26/2024

  Our records show on February 7, 2024, we received a letter from **************** stating he wanted to transfer the funds from his Modern Woodmen of America annuity certificate to Vanguard.  Although Mr. ****** gave specific instructions and signed the letter, we require a Letter of Acceptance from Vanguard, the address where to mail the check, and the owners signature on the Vanguard transfer request. 
  
  In response to Mr. ****** letter, we sent a letter to Vanguard on February 19 stating we need a Letter of Acceptance, an address where to mail the check, and the owners signature before we can process a transfer to their company.  
  
  As of today, March 26, we have not been contacted by Vanguard in response to our letter or received any additional information from them regarding Mr. ****** transfer request.  We hope this information is helpful.  Thank you for allowing us the opportunity to respond to this matter.

  Customer response

  04/04/2024

   
  Complaint: 21480117
  
  I am rejecting this response because: Its too early to determine if the item can be resolved. After receiving the Woodmen response on March 26 we (my POA agent and I) called Vanguard to determine if they had received the documentation from  Woodmen. The Vanguard Agent confirmed that the documentation was received and attempted to prepare the Vanguard transfer documents. Apparently Vanguard was confused about the nature of the funds to be transferred/rolled over. a few days later we received documents from Vanguard via their online secure messenger. We filled in, signed, and returned the documents to Vanguard. Vanguard had provided only a digital signature option for the forms we filled out. Subsequently, Vanguard notified us of a problem with the process. We spoke to another Vanguard representative today, April 5, 2024. ******* explained that Vanguard had been confused about the reference to a "certificate number" which someone had interpreted as a CD. We had previously told Vanguard representatives that we were dealing with a *************** annuity. In addition, ******** stated that Woodmen would not accept a digital signature and new process forms would need to be created. The necessary forms have now been completed and a required current value statement for the account had been prepared. The next step is to print, sign, and send back the documents to Vanguard via ***** We're not sure if another copy of the Woodmen forms are going to be required but it will take several days for Vanguard to receive the signed processing documents and then send them back to Woodmen. Vanguard did indicate that it could take Woodmen 4 to 6 weeks to complete their own processing. Let's hope not.
  
  Sincerely,
  
  *************************

  

  Business response

  04/12/2024

  Regarding the comments we received from Mr. ******* we are continuing to wait for the transfer request from Vanguard.  Please note we will accept a digital signature on the request from Vanguard.  However, we will not accept a digital signature on Modern Woodmens transfer out form #****.  Mr. ****** signature on our form must be handwritten. 
  
  Additionally, after the transfer request from Vanguard is received, reviewed, and accepted, we will email Mr. ****** our transfer form for his completion.  **************** provided his email address on the correspondence dated February 6, 2024.  Mr. ****** can email the completed form back to ************************************************************************* or fax it to **************. 
  
  The check will be processed and sent to Vanguard within 7 to 10 business days.  We hope this information is helpful.

  Customer response

  04/19/2024

   
  Complaint: 21480117
  
  I am rejecting this response because: I am not sure I fully understand Modern Woodmen's response. It is not clear why Modern Woodmen is waiting for a response from Vanguard before providing their Transfer Out Form #****. I am satisfied that although they desire my handwritten signature that they only require an emailed copy of the completed and signed #**** form. We had to restart the transfer process with Vanguard due to a misunderstanding hey seemed to have had with the Modern Woodmen account type. Vanguard is now requiring handwritten signatures and forms to be mailed to them.
  
  Sincerely,
  
  *************************

  Customer response

  04/22/2024

  Complaint: 21480117
  
  I am rejecting this response because: I am not sure I fully understand Modern Woodmen's response. It is not clear why Modern Woodmen is waiting for a response from Vanguard before providing their Transfer Out Form #****. I am satisfied that although they desire my handwritten signature that they only require an emailed copy of the completed and signed #**** form. We had to restart the transfer process with Vanguard due to a misunderstanding hey seemed to have had with the Modern Woodmen account type. Vanguard is now requiring handwritten signatures and forms to be mailed to them.
  
  Sincerely,
  
  *************************

  

  Business response

  04/22/2024

  Modern Woodmen has a 3-step process for transfers.
  
  We require a transfer request from the receiving company (Vanguard).  The request needs to include our certificate number, the amount of the transfer, the plan type at the receiving company, the members signature, the address where to mail the check, and a letter of acceptance stating the company will accept the funds.
  
  We review and accept the receiving companys transfer request and then we mail our form, 1031, to the member. The member needs to mark full or partial transfer then sign and date and return to us in the preaddressed envelope provided.
  
  Once we receive the completed form 1031 from the member in good order, the form is processed, and a check is mailed to the receiving company.
  
  As of today, Monday, April 22, 2024, we have not received a transfer request from Vanguard pertaining to Mr. ****** **** certificate.  The document that **************** provided with his signature and instructions, dated February 6, 2024, is not sufficient. 
  
  Please have Mr. ****** contact Vanguard and have them forward their transfer request to Modern Woodmen to start the transfer process.   Our fax number is ************.    We hope this information is helpful. 

• Initial Complaint

  12/04/2023

  Complaint Type:

  Product Issues

  Status:

  Resolved

  More info

  Company contuues to tell me they will mail out form **** (Request for Cash Surrender Value). They do not send it. It's apparent they do not want anyone surrending their policy. Talked with several and they all tell me the same thing "we will mail the form to you." They need to be investigated as this smells like some kind of illegal business practice.

  

  Business response

  12/13/2023

  Modern Woodmen of America is not unwilling to send the necessary forms.  Due to the complainants court-appointed relationship to our annuitant, there may be limits on what actions the complainant can take on this certificate.  Therefore, legal documentation needs to be submitted and reviewed prior to determining the available next steps and which forms are appropriate to accomplish the transaction requested.  The complainant is now working with our home office staff to submit the legal documents necessary to move this matter forward.  We are grateful for his understanding.

  Customer response

  12/14/2023

   
  Better Business Bureau:
  
  I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ********, and find that this resolution is satisfactory to me.
  
  Sincerely,
  
  *******************************

• Initial Complaint

  02/17/2023

  Complaint Type:

  Product Issues

  Status:

  Resolved

  More info

  Approximately $10000 was deducted from my brokerage account JWP ****** by Modern Woodmens financial services. I did not give them permission to deduct my money. I demand my money be refunded immediately. I also demand at least $5000 punitive damages for intentional infliction of emotional distress.

  

  Business response

  03/14/2023

  Money deducted from the account was due to IRS deductions. The firm has no control over the amount deducted under IRS regulations. The amount deducted was a higher rate than normal due to an incorrect social security number. The firm and the firms custodian reached out to the consumer multiple times in various methods over several years to assist the consumer in correcting the social security number. However, the consumer did not act upon any of the instructions, nor accept the firms offer of assistance in completing the required documents. The firm follows IRS withholding and deduction regulations. The firm denies the allegations of intentionally inflicting emotional distress. The firm denies the consumers request.

• Initial Complaint

  06/22/2022

  Complaint Type:

  Product Issues

  Status:

  Resolved

  More info

  I wish to surrender a certificate for cash value, but Modern Woodmen does not make the form for doing so available online, except for customers in **********. I have contacted my assigned representative multiple times to request the required form and only one email has been acknowledged. He replied to that email to state he would send the form within the week, which he did not. I want the form sent to my email on file, and I want a different representative assigned to me, because the form must be signed by an agent, and I do not believe the one assigned to me will sign the one I send in.Timeline May 12 - Emailed representative *********************************** to request form; no response June 2 - Emailed representative *********************************** to confirm receipt of previous email and reiterate request; no response June 9 - Emailed *********************************** and copied "Service.Member" email address to complain about lack of response to previous to emails and restate request for form; received near immedate response stating I would have the form this week June 16 - Emailed *********************************** and Service.Member email address complain that I still do not not have form and that I want a new representative; no response

  

  Business response

  07/07/2022

  We are concerned to hear from the BBB regarding this matter.Sadly, we were unaware of our members concerns until she notified the BBB.  The email address she was using is not a valid one for our organization, and she did not call our home office as she has in the past.  We have corresponded with the member as of July 6, 2022, as per her request and will work with her directly to resolve her concerns and answer any additional questions she might have.

  Customer response

  07/11/2022

   
  Better Business Bureau:
  
  I have reviewed the response made by the business in reference to complaint ID ********. I was contacted by the company, so I have received the resolution that was desired.

  However, it is dishonest of them to say they were unaware of the issue, as I messaged them through their secure messaging portal and the email I noted is the account that messages are sent to through the portal. I will also note their response does not acknowledge the lack of responses from their representative. They are not behaving as a trustworthy business. 
  
  Sincerely,
  
  *****************************

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